How is it that Clemson is able to recruit like this?

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  1. #301
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    Originally Posted by traxx View Post
    Swamp fox is the kinda guy that would advocate for kicking a FG on 3rd down so that they would have another try in case something screwed up.
    Swamp Fox is the kind of guy that makes eye contact with other dudes while he eats bananas.

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  2. #302
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    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    Say bullshit all you want. Clemson is an afterthought for the press even in Charlotte. Cam Newton taking a shit is a bigger story than Clemson. Tell me I'm wrong.
    Uh, you're ****in wrong bud. I'm not trying to start shit with you and say you're a liar or anything, you may just be speaking from your observations or opinions. From my perspective, from the local media/press, from going to watch games at bars which are always loaded with Clemson grads/fans, I will say they have as much coverage in Charlotte as UNC and Duke. Clemson has 2 radio stations in Charlotte that air their games as first priority during football season. They have a channel in the Charlotte metro that covers their football as the flagship sports team for crying out loud, c'mon man they've made it to the big-times similar to Oregon's surge to the spotlight. This doesn't have shit to do with the Panther's coverage, of course that's the area's main team, but guess what? they don't play in college.

    **TL,DR: Clemson is bigger in football to the state of North Carolina and is covered in football more than even the state's own universities and it's not even close. They have most-definitely arrived.**
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  3. #303
    Originally Posted by Dingo View Post
    Uh, you're ****in wrong bud. I'm not trying to start shit with you and say you're a liar or anything, you may just be speaking from your observations or opinions. From my perspective, from the local media/press, from going to watch games at bars which are always loaded with Clemson grads/fans, I will say they have as much coverage in Charlotte as UNC and Duke. Clemson has 2 radio stations in Charlotte that air their games as first priority during football season. They have a channel in the Charlotte metro that covers their football as the flagship sports team for crying out loud, c'mon man they've made it to the big-times similar to Oregon's surge to the spotlight. This doesn't have shit to do with the Panther's coverage, of course that's the area's main team, but guess what? they don't play in college.

    **TL,DR: Clemson is bigger in football to the state of North Carolina and is covered in football more than even the state's own universities and it's not even close. They have most-definitely arrived.**
    It has everything to do with the Panthers. That is still the top spot in Charlotte. It's not even close. When you are second fiddle in town you do not get the scrutiny the top dog does. It doesn't matter that on is college and one is pro. Pro still gets all the resources and the most attention. Your perception is fine that they get coverage but in the "news world" they are not even close to being on the same level as the Panthers.

  4. #304
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    Dude, The Panthers play in the NFL... HOW THE **** DOES THAT NOT MATTER?

  5. #305
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    We're talking about coverage for potential recruiting coverage for college right? I wan't to make sure we're not arguing for different points here.
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  6. #306
    Ask yourself this question. If every football team's head coach held a press conference at the same time on Monday and a paper could only cover one. Who would the Observer cover? Who would the Oklahoman and World cover?

  7. #307
    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    It has everything to do with the Panthers. That is still the top spot in Charlotte. It's not even close. When you are second fiddle in town you do not get the scrutiny the top dog does. It doesn't matter that on is college and one is pro. Pro still gets all the resources and the most attention. Your perception is fine that they get coverage but in the "news world" they are not even close to being on the same level as the Panthers.
    Dude, college football coverage has absolutely nothing to do with NFL coverage. In NC and SC Clemson gets all the love when it comes to football. Hell, even in Atlanta Clemson has a huge presence due their alumni.
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  8. #308
    Originally Posted by Dingo View Post
    We're talking about coverage for potential recruiting coverage for college right? I wan't to make sure we're not arguing for different points here.
    I said they are able to get away with more because they aren't the top dog in their closest major market. I even referenced Penn St. Both of those schools ride shotgun to pro teams for press coverage. OU doesn't just because of the lack of pro teams. The press in OK can make a name for themselves by breaking OU stories. In Charlotte's case, as well as Philly and Pitt, they would make a much bigger name digging into the NFL teams for stories.

  9. #309
    Originally Posted by MontyFranklyn View Post
    Dude, college football coverage has absolutely nothing to do with NFL coverage. In NC and SC Clemson gets all the love when it comes to football. Hell, even in Atlanta Clemson has a huge presence due their alumni.
    You're a fool. Do you think SC gets the coverage the Rams do? How about the Huskies vs the Seahawks? Badgers vs Packer? Illinois or hell even Notre Dame vs the Bears? What teams get the most resources spent on them.

  10. #310
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    What the **** are you going on about? It's pretty damn clear that Clemson received a helluva lot of national media-attention the last few years, well more that OU. Hell, here in Charlotte, they've received more coverage than the Panthers did. Obviously that was because the Panthers performed poorly, but it is what it is.

    I still don't understand what point you're trying to make. Clemson has a lot of media coverage. They are a big name. They have earned it.

  11. #311
    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    You're a fool. Do you think SC gets the coverage the Rams do? How about the Huskies vs the Seahawks? Badgers vs Packer? Illinois or hell even Notre Dame vs the Bears? What teams get the most resources spent on them.
    You are an idiot that can't grasp the point. When it comes to CFB coverage, in NC and SC Clemson is reigning supreme. That is the point.
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  12. #312
    Originally Posted by MontyFranklyn View Post
    You are an idiot that can't grasp the point. When it comes to CFB coverage, in NC and SC Clemson is reigning supreme. That is the point.
    Do you think the Observer's best guy covers Clemson or the Panthers? Answer my questions. I'll walk you through it.

  13. #313
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    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    Do you think the Observer's best guy covers Clemson or the Panthers? Answer my questions. I'll walk you through it.
    Can you read the title of the thread? Sound it out, if not I'll walk you through it.
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  14. #314
    Originally Posted by Dingo View Post
    Can you read the title of the thread? Sound it out, if not I'll walk you through it.
    Do you believe every all teams cheat? Not necessarily the program itself but boosters?

  15. #315
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    Originally Posted by MontyFranklyn View Post
    You are an idiot that can't grasp the point. When it comes to CFB coverage, in NC and SC Clemson is reigning supreme. That is the point.
    I'd be curious if Clemson is more popular than South Carolina in the state of South Carolina now.

  16. #316
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    Originally Posted by MontyFranklyn View Post
    Dude, college football coverage has absolutely nothing to do with NFL coverage. In NC and SC Clemson gets all the love when it comes to football. Hell, even in Atlanta Clemson has a huge presence due their alumni.
    When Spurrier was at SC that wasn't the case, but it is now.

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  17. #317
    Originally Posted by Yuck Fu View Post
    I'd be curious if Clemson is more popular than South Carolina in the state of South Carolina now.
    Probably still SC but a bunch of band wagon jumpers are making it close.
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  18. #318
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    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    Do you believe every all teams cheat? Not necessarily the program itself but boosters?
    No one is an angel, if you think Clemson's success is a result of cheating, then I think you are an idiot. Give them credit. They worked hard to get to the spot they are now. It's too bad we didn't do the same

  19. #319
    Originally Posted by Dingo View Post
    No one is an angel, if you think Clemson's success is a result of cheating, then I think you are an idiot. Give them credit. They worked hard to get to the spot they are now. It's too bad we didn't do the same
    Why do you think it's not? It was the last time they were good. BTW what's the top sports story in the Observer today?

  20. #320
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    No one besides you keeps mentioning the Observer. Who gives a ****? You're telling me Clemson isn't getting coverage here?

    Pardon me for calling you an idiot. You're an obtuse retard
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  21. #321
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    Originally Posted by jdizzle View Post
    Location, location, location! They are located in prime territory. The Carolinas have a lot of players, and they are near Georgia and Florida. So that plays a lot into it!
    Hooker, hookers, hookers! They are located in prime hooker territory. The Carolinas have a lot of hookers, and they are near Georgia and Florida from where they can buy even more hookers!
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  22. #322
    Originally Posted by Dingo View Post
    No one besides you keeps mentioning the Observer. Who gives a ****? You're telling me Clemson isn't getting coverage here?

    Pardon me for calling you an idiot. You're an obtuse retard
    You're the one saying Clemson gets more press in Charlotte than the Panthers because the Panthers suck this year. Afraid to go look at your paper and answer the question?

  23. #323
    Originally Posted by meandmybutt View Post
    Hooker, hookers, hookers! They are located in prime hooker territory. The Carolinas have a lot of hookers, and they are near Georgia and Florida from where they can buy even more hookers!
    Location is part. As well as USC being down. Spurrier went through a struggle the same way Stoops did with recruiting. VaTech did the same both of those helped Clemson quite a bit. I still believe the bag man visits more often now a days.

  24. #324
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    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    You're the one saying Clemson gets more press in Charlotte than the Panthers because the Panthers suck this year. Afraid to go look at your paper and answer the question?
    This is my last post directed towards you which is unfortunate because earlier in the thread you had a decent stance on the topic, but for some reason you went Simple Jack on us. You seem to think the Panthers and the Clemson Tigers compete for recruits.

    Do you really think Dabo is running a program that utilizes prostitution, booster "hundred-dollar handshakes", and other various forms of cheating to get to where they are?

    The point is, they're doing a fantastic job at getting their program to the top of the ranks, and 99% of universities would love to have their success. They worked harder than probably everyone else to get to this point. Bama doesn't have to work that hard, recruits would show up there either way. Clemson has 50 people in their staff that work on recruiting, places like Georgia Tech have 5..

    Clemson is serious about their progression, and it shows.
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  25. #325
    Originally Posted by Dingo View Post
    This is my last post directed towards you which is unfortunate because earlier in the thread you had a decent stance on the topic, but for some reason you went Simple Jack on us. You seem to think the Panthers and the Clemson Tigers compete for recruits.

    Do you really think Dabo is running a program that utilizes prostitution, booster "hundred-dollar handshakes", and other various forms of cheating to get to where they are?

    The point is, they're doing a fantastic job at getting their program to the top of the ranks, and 99% of universities would love to have their success. They worked harder than probably everyone else to get to this point. Bama doesn't have to work that hard, recruits would show up there either way. Clemson has 50 people in their staff that work on recruiting, places like Georgia Tech have 5..

    Clemson is serious about their progression, and it shows.
    What I'm saying is Clemson is absolutely cheating. Just like everyone else. I think they have taken it to the next level. Just like they did the last time their football team had a pulse. There have been a couple other factors that have helped.

    The press aspect is they aren't under the microscope the way other teams are. You argue they are huge in Charlotte. I will grant you they have definitely picked up popularity there. Today's sports headline was the Panther's O-Line. This shows they are 2nd fiddle and don't have someone one them every second they way an Oklahoma does. This allows them to get away with things other schools can't. SMU in the 80's didn't have the big coverage until it became evident something was up. I don't think Dabo or any other coach is paying players. I think the boosters have kicked it up a notch. If you don't think this is possible you're fooling yourself. They have a history of this just like OU. If you've been around big time college football players you know this happens. It even happened at OU when we sucked in the 90's.

  26. #326
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    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    What I'm saying is Clemson is absolutely cheating. Just like everyone else. I think they have taken it to the next level. Just like they did the last time their football team had a pulse. There have been a couple other factors that have helped.

    The press aspect is they aren't under the microscope the way other teams are. You argue they are huge in Charlotte. I will grant you they have definitely picked up popularity there. Today's sports headline was the Panther's O-Line. This shows they are 2nd fiddle and don't have someone one them every second they way an Oklahoma does. This allows them to get away with things other schools can't. SMU in the 80's didn't have the big coverage until it became evident something was up. I don't think Dabo or any other coach is paying players. I think the boosters have kicked it up a notch. If you don't think this is possible you're fooling yourself. They have a history of this just like OU. If you've been around big time college football players you know this happens. It even happened at OU when we sucked in the 90's.
    Mick, I understand about the "scrutiny" aspect of the press, and your point is valid in that they don't get punished for their short-comings compared to others such as how they've crucified the Panthers for being total shit this year.

    To your other point, I agree there is something behind the scenes everywhere, but I don't think it's a huge deal. There might be a booster here and there that will help a recruit out with something or pay for a meal/whatever here and there. If you think the actually their recruiting department relies on those generous boosters, then honestly man, I think you're just bitter that they beat the shit out of us twice and are looking for an excuse. I think Dabo is a good man. I think Brent Venables is a good man. I think they worked harder than Stoops and Co. and that it clearly shows. We should have been in the top 5-10 class of recruiting since 1999, but we aren't. Our boosters are just as capable of the under-the-table gifts as theirs.

    I hate Clemson more than any other university, including Texas and OSU. My roommate is a Clemson masters of engineering grad and I've been to many bars here in the Charlotte area showing their games and I hate their fan-base and their new money and that they don't even know college football existed before 2005. I hope they lose every game and their school goes bankrupt and they are exposed for using everything illegal known to man for their football program... but damn, at some point you have to owe it to yourself to admit that they are legit.

    I still have to be a fan of college football. I choose to exploit my privilege of seeing college football through non-crimson tinted glasses. I still hate Clemson and hope everything but loss of life and loss of peoples livelihoods happens to that place and I know that's a horrible perspective to have, especially over something such as college football. They are legit, they probably do 99% of business and protocols by the books. They probably would go after boosters that try to sneak in shady-gifts to the players/recruits because it's not worth it. Dabo probably awakens everyday hoping that no one did anything illegally while he was not observing.

    They're a hot football school right now. It is what it is and honestly, instead of trying to call them out and hoping they are cheating, we should be mirroring our program similar to theirs. If you can't admire what they have done there in the last decade, then you aren't a fan of college football as a whole. You're only a fan for OU, and that's fine as long as you keep your biased shit-spewing posts to yourself.

    I hope Bama beats the **** out of them and Clemson returns to bottom-half of the top 25 forever.
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  27. #327
    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    What I'm saying is Clemson is absolutely cheating. Just like everyone else. I think they have taken it to the next level. Just like they did the last time their football team had a pulse. There have been a couple other factors that have helped.

    The press aspect is they aren't under the microscope the way other teams are. You argue they are huge in Charlotte. I will grant you they have definitely picked up popularity there. Today's sports headline was the Panther's O-Line. This shows they are 2nd fiddle and don't have someone one them every second they way an Oklahoma does. This allows them to get away with things other schools can't. SMU in the 80's didn't have the big coverage until it became evident something was up. I don't think Dabo or any other coach is paying players. I think the boosters have kicked it up a notch. If you don't think this is possible you're fooling yourself. They have a history of this just like OU. If you've been around big time college football players you know this happens. It even happened at OU when we sucked in the 90's.
    Jesus Christ, not this shit again. Let's ignore the fact that they're in the middle of demographic hotbed and they are on kids in that area, like most schools in that area, before they are known nationally.
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  28. #328
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    Originally Posted by HellVol View Post
    When Spurrier was at SC that wasn't the case, but it is now.

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    Yeah, it's two years old, but unless a shitpot full of Clemson fans discovered Facebook since then, this map probably hasn't changed much:

    http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2...l-fan-map.html



    And here's the same map, focused on South Carolina:



    In Columbia, residents refer to a section of South Carolina known as The Upstate as if it were on another planet rather than a few dozen miles down (er, up) the highway. But clearly it’s a different place, a small, exotic region where Clemson — one of whose colors is known as “northwest purple” — isn’t dominated by its archrival. Apparently years of “Clemsoning,” slang for elaborately choking in big games, have inured South Carolinians to the Tigers’ 61-40 record against the Gamecocks.

  29. #329
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    Originally Posted by Dingo View Post
    Mick, I understand about the "scrutiny" aspect of the press, and your point is valid in that they don't get punished for their short-comings compared to others such as how they've crucified the Panthers for being total shit this year.

    To your other point, I agree there is something behind the scenes everywhere, but I don't think it's a huge deal. There might be a booster here and there that will help a recruit out with something or pay for a meal/whatever here and there. If you think the actually their recruiting department relies on those generous boosters, then honestly man, I think you're just bitter that they beat the shit out of us twice and are looking for an excuse. I think Dabo is a good man. I think Brent Venables is a good man. I think they worked harder than Stoops and Co. and that it clearly shows. We should have been in the top 5-10 class of recruiting since 1999, but we aren't. Our boosters are just as capable of the under-the-table gifts as theirs.

    I hate Clemson more than any other university, including Texas and OSU. My roommate is a Clemson masters of engineering grad and I've been to many bars here in the Charlotte area showing their games and I hate their fan-base and their new money and that they don't even know college football existed before 2005. I hope they lose every game and their school goes bankrupt and they are exposed for using everything illegal known to man for their football program... but damn, at some point you have to owe it to yourself to admit that they are legit.

    I still have to be a fan of college football. I choose to exploit my privilege of seeing college football through non-crimson tinted glasses. I still hate Clemson and hope everything but loss of life and loss of peoples livelihoods happens to that place and I know that's a horrible perspective to have, especially over something such as college football. They are legit, they probably do 99% of business and protocols by the books. They probably would go after boosters that try to sneak in shady-gifts to the players/recruits because it's not worth it. Dabo probably awakens everyday hoping that no one did anything illegally while he was not observing.

    They're a hot football school right now. It is what it is and honestly, instead of trying to call them out and hoping they are cheating, we should be mirroring our program similar to theirs. If you can't admire what they have done there in the last decade, then you aren't a fan of college football as a whole. You're only a fan for OU, and that's fine as long as you keep your biased shit-spewing posts to yourself.

    I hope Bama beats the **** out of them and Clemson returns to bottom-half of the top 25 forever.
    Your first paragraph leads me to:

    Clemson, SC Tallahassee, FL
    Danny Ford Bobby Bowden
    Dabo Sweeny Jimbo Fisher

    Sly fox bumpkins with that hidden, wink wink Southern winandwewontcare support in towns that are essentially islands.

    That formula works, albeit culturally differently, in places like State College as well.

    I was stationed in SC in the '90s and taught at FSU the next decade. An outsider surrounded by it feels "The Game" like you can feel the cultural racism bubbling just below the surface.

  30. #330
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    Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    Yeah, it's two years old, but unless a shitpot full of Clemson fans discovered Facebook since then, this map probably hasn't changed much:

    http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2...l-fan-map.html



    And here's the same map, focused on South Carolina:

    As a Clemson fan living in SC my entire life I can tell you with 100% certainty that map is total BS. Look hard enough and you can find a map to show anything.



    There is another two or three that were done by reddit.


  31. #331
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    Originally Posted by awr90 View Post
    They have probably a top 3 staff in regards to recruiting. Clemson had fringe top 15 classes up until a couple years ago.
    Dabo made the decision and got the approval of the administration to pay top dollar for the best assistants/recruiters in the country when he was hired. As I recall Dabo/school was the first to pay an assistant $1 million plus when he hired Chad Morris for $1 mil in 2011 and was paying him $1.3 mil when he took the SMU job. Morris was two years removed from coach Lake Travis, TX H.S. when Dabo hired him after one year as Tulsa OC. Kevin Steele was Clemson's first DC and was let go in his 3rd year when WVU hung 70 on them in the bowl game. He hired Brent Venables paying Brent $900K ($300K raise over OU). Brent is now making $1.425 million (Mike Stoops makes $900K).

    Clemson pay for all of their assistant coaches is $5.39 mil. OU's is $4.39 mil. That is $110K more per assistant or 22.2% per assistant. LSU pays assistants (under Les) $5.78 mil. Alabama $5.32 plus they pay a former assistant and now in a staff position $440K for $5.76 mil. Texas aTm pays $4.81 mil. Georgia pays $4.68 mil. FSU pays $4.59. Ohio State pays assistants $4.58 mil. Texas $4.55 mil(under Charley Strong). Tennessee $4.54 mil. Florida $4.53 mil. Auburn $4.46 mil. OU is #12 in assistant salaries.

    If you compare average staff assistant salaries to annual recruiting rankings there is a high correlation among the top 12 schools as 9, 10 and 9 of the highest paying schools had top 12 classes. The school that fell out of the top 10 most frequently was OU which failed to make the top 12 classes twice. Those that made the top 12 classes most frequently was USC all three years and Michigan two years. Of course because USC is a private school we do not know their coaches salaries, likewise for Notre Dame who had 1 top 12 class.

    http://www.greenvilleonline.com/stor...ises/81312516/

    http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextr...6ce01901e.html

    http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/sala...ball/assistant
    Last edited by SoonerSpock; January 8th, 2017 at 09:40 AM.

  32. #332
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    Originally Posted by Tigerfan4life View Post
    As a Clemson fan living in SC my entire life I can tell you with 100% certainty that map is total BS. Look hard enough and you can find a map to show anything.



    There is another two or three that were done by reddit.

    I have always been interested in the Clemson/SC fan split because of the fact that it is one of the few states where the so called "little brother" has a winning record over the state school and by pretty much all standards has a better tradition in football. Clemson's stadium is as large (actually slightly larger) that USC's and they fill it up. I can't think of any other place with the "state school/ag school" dynamic that is like that.

    However, the other map that was shown is interesting. If you go to the interactive version of that map they break it down by zip code and you can zoom in on every single zip code in the country to see the split. It's pretty detailed obviously and supposedly was done by survey.

    All you need to do to see that the map tigerfan posted is bogus is to look at Arkansas.

  33. #333
    Originally Posted by MontyFranklyn View Post
    Jesus Christ, not this shit again. Let's ignore the fact that they're in the middle of demographic hotbed and they are on kids in that area, like most schools in that area, before they are known nationally.
    Watch college football for a while. You'll start to see patterns with teams. I'm sure you thought Miami was good because it was in the middle of a demographic hotbed? How about USC? How about SMU? How about Baylor (we'll never know all of what really happened there) How about Ole Miss suddenly landing a #1 recruiting class? All of those schools were in your hotbed for years just as Clemson.

    Hell for you OU to get good decades ago they had to cheat. The climb to the top isn't easy and doesn't happen as fast as it did at Clemson. Case in point look at Clemson the last time they were good. Why didn't they stay good? Oh yeah they were cheating. Amazingly it took them 25 years in that hotbed to become respectable again.

    Every school cheats. I don't think Clemson is pulling a SMU, Miami, or Baylor but I would shocked if the boosters are loosening their purse strings. BTW I don't believe the institutions and coaches actually cheat (except in very few cases).

    I've heard some stories from people that were at parties where recruits told some stories about Ole Miss that would make your draw drop.

  34. #334
    Originally Posted by Yuck Fu View Post
    I have always been interested in the Clemson/SC fan split because of the fact that it is one of the few states where the so called "little brother" has a winning record over the state school and by pretty much all standards has a better tradition in football. Clemson's stadium is as large (actually slightly larger) that USC's and they fill it up. I can't think of any other place with the "state school/ag school" dynamic that is like that.

    However, the other map that was shown is interesting. If you go to the interactive version of that map they break it down by zip code and you can zoom in on every single zip code in the country to see the split. It's pretty detailed obviously and supposedly was done by survey.

    All you need to do to see that the map tigerfan posted is bogus is to look at Arkansas.
    USC has about 1/3 more students per year than Clemson. Clemson is a much better school and it's harder to get into. I would imagine there is a larger turnover of students at USC. I would think the map showing Clemson being popular in the NW part of state and the rest being USC is pretty accurate. I would think Charleston would be the one area where Clemson could jump. Also just a gut feeling but I would think more Clemson grads head out of state for better jobs. No scientific facts just what I've seen. The central to eastern side appears to be split about like OU & OSU. That's just by observing what fans wear and cars.
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  35. #335
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    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post

    Every school cheats.

  36. #336
    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    Watch college football for a while. You'll start to see patterns with teams. I'm sure you thought Miami was good because it was in the middle of a demographic hotbed? How about USC? How about SMU? How about Baylor (we'll never know all of what really happened there) How about Ole Miss suddenly landing a #1 recruiting class? All of those schools were in your hotbed for years just as Clemson.

    Hell for you OU to get good decades ago they had to cheat. The climb to the top isn't easy and doesn't happen as fast as it did at Clemson. Case in point look at Clemson the last time they were good. Why didn't they stay good? Oh yeah they were cheating. Amazingly it took them 25 years in that hotbed to become respectable again.

    Every school cheats. I don't think Clemson is pulling a SMU, Miami, or Baylor but I would shocked if the boosters are loosening their purse strings. BTW I don't believe the institutions and coaches actually cheat (except in very few cases).

    I've heard some stories from people that were at parties where recruits told some stories about Ole Miss that would make your draw drop.
    Dude, they aren't going to areas outside of their region getting the top players. They are getting kids from Tennessee, Georgia, SC, NC, Florida, Virginia and Alabama. Sometimes they'll get a lower level kid from Texas. They also haven't been in the top 10 in the past 5 years more than once.

    You also brought up Miami, USC and SMU. Miami's dynasty was built on urban kids from south Florida. In all actuality Miami changed football recruiting as we know. We they did and people saw how successful they were at it they copied it. That is why you saw the rise of Florida as a state in the 90s. That is where the term Florida speed came from and was later coined as SEC speed. Like Clemson today, Miami did go out of Florida, but they didn't get the top players from states outside of their geographical region though. USC's dynasty was the same way. They recruited their region and to a smaller extent Texas really. Same with SMU, but they were cheating way more than they should have.

    This whole argument comes off so whiny though. Anytime any school has more success than yours the ultimate conclusion is that they are cheating. This sounds so ridiculous, especially when it comes to schools in the south. Essentially what you are saying is that kids that southern schools have to pay kids that grew up in the south to stay in the south. Schools that they have grown up watching on their local channels. I guess all kids want to flock to that landlocked state, hot, dry state in the middle of the country because they want to see corn fed white girls and the best cattle in the nation and some oil rigs. How could a kid resist?
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  37. #337
    Maybe Clemson was always good but couldn't win titles as a smaller all male school

    Originally Posted by Yuck Fu View Post
    I have always been interested in the Clemson/SC fan split because of the fact that it is one of the few states where the so called "little brother" has a winning record over the state school and by pretty much all standards has a better tradition in football. Clemson's stadium is as large (actually slightly larger) that USC's and they fill it up. I can't think of any other place with the "state school/ag school" dynamic that is like that.
    .
    The only one I can think of is Boise St or where the little brother is a private school like USCw.

  38. #338
    Originally Posted by Yuck Fu View Post
    I have always been interested in the Clemson/SC fan split because of the fact that it is one of the few states where the so called "little brother" has a winning record over the state school and by pretty much all standards has a better tradition in football. Clemson's stadium is as large (actually slightly larger) that USC's and they fill it up. I can't think of any other place with the "state school/ag school" dynamic that is like that.

    However, the other map that was shown is interesting. If you go to the interactive version of that map they break it down by zip code and you can zoom in on every single zip code in the country to see the split. It's pretty detailed obviously and supposedly was done by survey.

    All you need to do to see that the map tigerfan posted is bogus is to look at Arkansas.
    Also look at California, where it shows Cal as having by far the largest fanbase in the state...

  39. #339
    Originally Posted by Yuck Fu View Post
    Beck never cheated!

  40. #340
    Originally Posted by MontyFranklyn View Post
    Dude, they aren't going to areas outside of their region getting the top players. They are getting kids from Tennessee, Georgia, SC, NC, Florida, Virginia and Alabama. Sometimes they'll get a lower level kid from Texas. They also haven't been in the top 10 in the past 5 years more than once.

    You also brought up Miami, USC and SMU. Miami's dynasty was built on urban kids from south Florida. In all actuality Miami changed football recruiting as we know. We they did and people saw how successful they were at it they copied it. That is why you saw the rise of Florida as a state in the 90s. That is where the term Florida speed came from and was later coined as SEC speed. Like Clemson today, Miami did go out of Florida, but they didn't get the top players from states outside of their geographical region though. USC's dynasty was the same way. They recruited their region and to a smaller extent Texas really. Same with SMU, but they were cheating way more than they should have.

    This whole argument comes off so whiny though. Anytime any school has more success than yours the ultimate conclusion is that they are cheating. This sounds so ridiculous, especially when it comes to schools in the south. Essentially what you are saying is that kids that southern schools have to pay kids that grew up in the south to stay in the south. Schools that they have grown up watching on their local channels. I guess all kids want to flock to that landlocked state, hot, dry state in the middle of the country because they want to see corn fed white girls and the best cattle in the nation and some oil rigs. How could a kid resist?
    Have you even read what I've written. I said OU cheats as well.

    What the hell are you talking about Miami changed recruiting as we know it? They took cheating to a new level.

    I never said they were going out of the region. That's why I said USC and Va Tech being down lately has helped them.

    Every team I brought up cheated. Do you not know that?

  41. #341
    Originally Posted by MontyFranklyn View Post
    Dude, they aren't going to areas outside of their region getting the top players. They are getting kids from Tennessee, Georgia, SC, NC, Florida, Virginia and Alabama. Sometimes they'll get a lower level kid from Texas. They also haven't been in the top 10 in the past 5 years more than once.

    You also brought up Miami, USC and SMU. Miami's dynasty was built on urban kids from south Florida. In all actuality Miami changed football recruiting as we know. We they did and people saw how successful they were at it they copied it. That is why you saw the rise of Florida as a state in the 90s. That is where the term Florida speed came from and was later coined as SEC speed. Like Clemson today, Miami did go out of Florida, but they didn't get the top players from states outside of their geographical region though. USC's dynasty was the same way. They recruited their region and to a smaller extent Texas really. Same with SMU, but they were cheating way more than they should have.

    This whole argument comes off so whiny though. Anytime any school has more success than yours the ultimate conclusion is that they are cheating. This sounds so ridiculous, especially when it comes to schools in the south. Essentially what you are saying is that kids that southern schools have to pay kids that grew up in the south to stay in the south. Schools that they have grown up watching on their local channels. I guess all kids want to flock to that landlocked state, hot, dry state in the middle of the country because they want to see corn fed white girls and the best cattle in the nation and some oil rigs. How could a kid resist?
    Is this the Miami recruiting we wall copy now?

    http://sports.yahoo.com/news/renegad...0753--spt.html

  42. #342
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    Originally Posted by MontyFranklyn View Post
    This whole argument comes off so whiny though. Anytime any school has more success than yours the ultimate conclusion is that they are cheating.
    You may have just been responding to the person you were quoting, but I wanna make it clear that the purpose of starting this thread was not to call into question Clemson's recruiting techniques. It was more about what are they doing that we aren't and that we should be trying to recruit the same type of talent.

    My take on it is that Stoops got lazy. He doesn't have the fire anymore. He knew that if he won 10 games a year, won the B12 more times than not, and won a bowl game now and then, that he could just sit back and rake in millions. I get that OU isn't in the middle of a hotbed of recruiting. But OU never has been that way and we're still one of the football blue bloods. We should still be able to recruit with the elites with the brand that we have.

  43. #343
    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    Is this the Miami recruiting we wall copy now?

    http://sports.yahoo.com/news/renegad...0753--spt.html
    Miami was the first major school that recruited inner city and urban black kids to fill a whole class. Before they did it most schools would maybe take two or three. They filled an entire class with them. Florida State and Florida soon copied them. Go back and look at rosters in the 80s and compare them to now and you'll see the increase of black players on rosters, especially in the south, rise significantly over time.

  44. #344
    Originally Posted by traxx View Post
    You may have just been responding to the person you were quoting, but I wanna make it clear that the purpose of starting this thread was not to call into question Clemson's recruiting techniques. It was more about what are they doing that we aren't and that we should be trying to recruit the same type of talent.

    My take on it is that Stoops got lazy. He doesn't have the fire anymore. He knew that if he won 10 games a year, won the B12 more times than not, and won a bowl game now and then, that he could just sit back and rake in millions. I get that OU isn't in the middle of a hotbed of recruiting. But OU never has been that way and we're still one of the football blue bloods. We should still be able to recruit with the elites with the brand that we have.
    Oh I got the general idea of the thread, but as I stated they aren't really out working or doing more than OU. Location is a huge factor that I think most of you are over looking. It is just harder to sell the best kids in the nation on traveling sometimes as far as 15 hours to go to school when the can stay closer to home. OU doesn't have the advantages they had back in the 80s anymore.

  45. #345
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    Originally Posted by notre dame joe View Post
    Maybe Clemson was always good but couldn't win titles as a smaller all male school



    The only one I can think of is Boise St or where the little brother is a private school like USCw.
    Penn State?

  46. #346
    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    USC has about 1/3 more students per year than Clemson. Clemson is a much better school and it's harder to get into. I would imagine there is a larger turnover of students at USC. I would think the map showing Clemson being popular in the NW part of state and the rest being USC is pretty accurate. I would think Charleston would be the one area where Clemson could jump. Also just a gut feeling but I would think more Clemson grads head out of state for better jobs. No scientific facts just what I've seen. The central to eastern side appears to be split about like OU & OSU. That's just by observing what fans wear and cars.
    i believe Charleston is the most represented metro among Clemson students. Clemson has fans all over the state. i grew up in Florence and it is at least 50-50 Clemson-SC.

    the idea that it would only be popular in the Upstate of SC doesn't make sense given it is a state and national public university.

    I went to Clemson but I wouldn't say Clemson is much better than SC. They are both good universities. Clemson is harder to get into because it takes less students total.

  47. #347
    Christian Wilkens, one of Clemson's best defensive players, and plays on offense occasionally, and caught the punt fake pass against Okla last year, is from Mass.

    i would say Clemson recruiting players out of south Florida is recruiting out of region.

    Clemson has recruited a 5 star QB out of Indiana, Hunter Johnson i believe is his name.

  48. #348
    Originally Posted by CarolinaSooner View Post
    ACC was not tough in the 00s....quit kidding yourself. SEC was tougher with LSU, UF (Meyer won 2 titles), Auburn and obviously Bama (3). Big 12 was equally tough with OU, Texas, Nebraska. KState, Kansas, Colorado had their moments as well. The only ACC team which made it to the BCS National Championships till the current playoff system was FSU who we defeated.

    Dabo has been lucky since FSU was down till the old man was forced out. Miami imploded after joining the ACC. If these 2 had maintained their standards, Clemson would have continued their 9-3 or 7-5 seasons. You guys are in a sweet spot now. Good luck and hopefully you can get a championship out of this current lucky spell.
    this is what you SEC guys do though. you try to use fact that SEC teams won national titles to assert that the SEC was best overall conference in those seasons. that's not always the case.

    the SEC was dreadful this year but if Bama had won, you would probably be saying SEC is best conference.

  49. #349
    Originally Posted by OUMick View Post
    Probably still SC but a bunch of band wagon jumpers are making it close.
    you are speculating. Clemson always been a much better football program than SC. i think probably a majority of the sidewalk fans are Clemson fans.

    bandwagoners would have flocked to SC when they had a good 4 year run with Spurrier. that was the best SC has ever been.

  50. #350
    Originally Posted by Swamp Fox View Post
    Christian Wilkens, one of Clemson's best defensive players, and plays on offense occasionally, and caught the punt fake pass against Okla last year, is from Mass.
    .
    dat ACC footprint!

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