Posted 512 day(s) ago by DelMarSooner152965 Views 2970 Replies
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December 13th, 201211:13 AM
One point he has skipped over is just how much power the SEC has. The SEC could decide not to partner with ESPN on their network and go for the Big 1G model. If they went that route they could wait until the 2nd Tier Rights deal expires with ESPN and keep that content as well. If they did this in collaboration with the Big 1G it would effectively destroy ESPN's control of CFB, without SEC and Big 1G content ESPN would die on the vine in terms of CFB programming. They also have the threat of doing a deal with Fox instead of ESPN which would change the game as significantly as when the NFL left CBS for Fox so many years ago.
Of course the SEC doesn't want to do that. They would rather stick with ESPN but they are going to get more than a few hundred pounds of flesh in the process. If you think the SEC controls college football content on Sportscenter now you haven't seen anything. This is part of why the SEC Network numbers are going to be ridiculous and ESPN is essentially going to go "all in" with the SEC. As an interesting tidbit btw the proposed location for the headquarters of the SEC Network? Charlotte, NC. Read into that what you wish. If you look at the SEC Digital Network online you can also tell they basically have everything being put in place now, the production value for content on the website is top notch.
Oh, and I wouldn't EVER bet against Mike Slive in anything. That dude sees about 8 moves ahead on the chess board and is an expert at getting things to break his way without directly being the cause. For instance he won't be the one to make a call to any ACC school to break up the conference, he will just make sure the schools he wants know they have an invite under the table and wait for other conferences to shatter the conference forcing the schools that have the most value and don't want to move to come his way.
December 13th, 201211:20 AM
From what I've read, Temple doesn't have a vote on that until June 1.
December 13th, 201211:30 AM
except the SEC really can't do that ... they only control 1 home game each .. for the next 10 years .. and you can't start a network with a bunch of 1AA games and bad non conf basketball ...
with ESPN as a partner they can put any non CBS game on the new SEC network .. just like the pac 12 is doing .. and that is how they get distrobution and high per household fees ..
December 13th, 201211:31 AM
I'm pretty sure they already vote since they already participate in the league.
Originally Posted by Mephistopheles
December 13th, 201212:11 PM
Wow, reading that makes you sound like someone talking about a cult... but, then again, folks in collie station are kind of pre-dispositioned for brain washing anyway. You DO have a scoreboard for the dog grave yard... and you planted trees in honor of students killed by falling logs... All that's missing is the "S... E... C..." chant.
December 13th, 201212:12 PM
Sure they could, that's exactly what the Big 1G Network is. At a minimum you still have 14 games plus a ton of basketball and baseball (the SEC has quality baseball). You also have 14 coaches shows and a ton of other avenues for content, just look at ESPNU and "SEC Storied" and how many "30 for 30" episodes they have that are based around SEC schools. That doesn't count buying some other Tier 2 games from ESPN that they currently sell to Fox or the virtual SEC Network which is just a group of stations that broadcast a game every week now. It certainly won't be anything close to as big as it could be in the short term but it would be good enough to get picked up on basic cable in likely every SEC state. Once the Tier 2 deal expires it would explode.
As I said though, that's not what the SEC wants to do. The point is that they COULD do it just as the Big 1G has. They also could make a deal with Fox or with NBC which is trying to start a sports network. It's the leverage that matters. The SEC has options and ESPN has built their CFB coverage around the SEC. The threat of it leaving would be devastating and thus they will pay just about anything to prevent that from happening and agree to just about anything the SEC wants in terms of content. It's a win/win for the SEC and ESPN but both sides have huge leverage in the negotiations.
The SEC wants ESPN because they are the best brand with the most viewership and Sportscenter dominates all other sports news shows. ESPN wants the SEC because they are the strongest CFB brand and they have built their programming around them. It's going to work out but the SEC is going to want a deal that dwarfs the other conferences and they will almost certainly get it.
December 13th, 201212:20 PM
From the above linked article:
A source told ESPN on Wednesday that Temple, as a football-only member, has voting rights but can't vote on dissolution of the league. With Temple unable to vote, that gives the seven basketball schools enough votes to dissolve the league.
December 13th, 201212:27 PM
Don't disagree with that but it doesn't change the truth of it. Like it or not, fair or unfair, the SEC has put itself in a position to dominate college football coverage and it has been a very well thought out and deliberate plan to get it there. A&M joining was just one piece of the puzzle. I had no idea just how powerful the SEC was or how well run the conference office was until we joined, the folks in Birmingham basically act like they are the NFL lite. By contrast in the Big 12 I could barely remember where the conference was even headquartered and the schools work much more in autonomy. The SEC looks at every issue in terms of how the conference can get stronger as a whole, while some members do get preferential treatment from time to time every member is taken care of and has an equal say.
From A&M's perspective they have benefitted because the conference desperately wants to solidify itself in the Texas market and all the TV sets there. That's why we got the UF game to start and it was placed on a weekend where they knew we would get Gameday. For Mizzou they got UGA at home on the same day and made a huge show of it as well, though not as big as what they did for A&M. By contrast TCU started on the road at KU and WVU got Baylor at home. The Big 12 missed a great opportunity to make a show out of both schools entering the league.
The Big 12 could really be great but the schools need to work together and think long term, that's how the SEC, Big 1G, and Pac 12 have done it.
December 13th, 201212:31 PM
that is not what the BTN did .. they own rights to conf games and lots of non conf games ..
espn owns all the sec tv rights except 14 games a year .. and lots of weeks where they have no rights
espn is not going to sell content back to a non espn owned (at least in part) network ...
the SEC network will look pretty much just like the BTN 50/50 owned ... but with espn instead of fox ..
December 13th, 201201:17 PM
That's because the Big 12 added, well, not the best teams, but only added to stay alive. TCU and WVU, not real exciting. The Big 12 can't work together because it's a ten team conference where each individual team is stronger than the conference. On a side note, the Big 12 is the only conference that doesn't put the logo on the teams uniforms, again because each team is stronger than the conference. All the more reason to blow it up now rather than in 13 years from now when the god forsaking GOR expires. Anywhere but here would be better!
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December 13th, 201201:26 PM
ESPN sells a couple games a week now to the SEC Network and Fox. It's no different than the LHN buying games to add. They would also work with the SEC out of fear the SEC would just take their 2nd Tier rights back when the deal expires.
It's not happening anyway but it is possible and thus the leverage exists. ESPN needs the SEC, they have built too much around it to lose it.
December 13th, 201201:30 PM
Agree on those points but it doesn't have to be that way. It's not like Miss State adds a lot of value to the SEC but they still get treated respectfully and the conference does all they can to help them. If the Big 12 would change its attitude and add some ACC teams it could be a much better conference than the Pac 12/16. The problem is Texas likes to run the show and OU was always one of the "Big 2" back to the Big 8 days. OU is more open to sharing power but Texas will never change the way it does things until Dodds is gone and maybe not then. OU could help force that change by banding together with the other 8 schools not named Texas.
December 13th, 201201:55 PM
The problem is the Big 12 is only better than the Big East, and maybe the ACC. Nebraska with it's national titles left, Coloardo with it's national titles left, and even Texas A&M left with its titles back in the day. All these teams were wrong to leave? They went to greener pastures, while OU sat around, or tried and failed to get into the PAC. There is nothing the Big 12 can do to overtake any of the big boys, even adding FSU and Clemson, not sure that brings us up to the SEC level. My issue is the Big 12 simply put is OU / Texas, and eight Mississippi State schools. There are very little traditional football powers left in the Big 12, and it's sad OU is so screwed going forward. Thank you David Boren.
December 13th, 201201:59 PM
December 13th, 201203:36 PM
Side note or not, it's actually a good point.
The 'branding' of the Big 12 sucks hard.
There should be a Big 12 logo on EVERYTHING during broadcasts.
December 13th, 201203:37 PM
and if there was, you would be ****ing about it being everywhere.
It's a non issue.
December 13th, 201203:38 PM
December 13th, 201203:52 PM
Then improve the ****ing logo. Problem solved.
You know exactly dick about how I would react other than what I've said.
Which is to actually SUGGEST that it should happen. It's only a non-issue to those in a state of denial about the plummeting reputation of the Big 12.
December 13th, 201203:55 PM
***Conference Apocalypse Part IV: The NeverEnding Story
I know how you would act. You people are all the same. Have to have something to **** about
December 13th, 201204:02 PM
Can we put this logo on Owen Field then?
December 13th, 201204:07 PM
Please no... that would be horrible...
December 13th, 201205:11 PM
sounds just like Bounce IYAM
December 13th, 201206:53 PM
The 7 Catholic BE schools agree to get out.....but how?
December 13th, 201207:01 PM
The big east is good as dead.
December 13th, 201207:18 PM
Tulane is getting the blame for being the straw that broke the Catholic, basketball-only school's collective back.
December 13th, 201207:46 PM
Wouldn't that be grand, oh that's right Boren would open his mouth, and it would all fall apart. He should take that billion dollar endowment, and buy his way out of the GOR...oh that's right he's the genius who came up with the GOR idea.
December 13th, 201208:20 PM
***Conference Apocalypse Part IV: The NeverEnding Story
Would love it. I understand that they want a home run to bring Texas in also but their losing value...quickly. They need OU at least to get back on the map
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December 13th, 201208:25 PM
Re: ***Conference Apocalypse Part IV: The NeverEnding Story
Thank GOD the Pac deal fell through. I still can't for the life of me understand why any OU fan would want any part of the Pac. The Big XII as it is NOW is better than the Pac for football and for money.
December 13th, 201208:26 PM
December 13th, 201208:45 PM
4 top 20 BCS schools in the PAC (Oregon, Stanford, Oregon St, UCLA) vs 2 in the Big 12 (K-state & OU). As far as money it's pretty close. Give the PAC a few years to get going, and then they will make more.
Throw in the fact that we get in a conference that everyone is equal and gets equal vs living under the shadow of Texas and the Texas "sword of Damocles" which is them leaving to be Independence. And if you think that's crap, then we would be in a stable conference that isn't losing members, and isn't fixing to lose any, PLUS we would get to keep some regional rivals too.
I would also love the B1G if we went with Texas, and Kansas and got reunited with the Corn Shuckers
December 13th, 201209:17 PM
December 13th, 201209:31 PM
Pac=2 bcs teams
Big 12=1 bcs team
If we went there, the money would follow.
December 14th, 201208:29 AM
December 14th, 201208:44 AM
December 14th, 201201:43 PM
Since realignment is driven in part by TV ratings it might be worth taking a look back at a partial list of the TV rating.
I am surprised that the OU Texas game was rated so low. A later kick off time might earn better TV ratings.
December 14th, 201201:53 PM
^Considering the early kick-off, the fact both teams had already lost a game, and the fact Texas hasn't fielded a good team in 3 years, I think the rating wasn't that bad.
December 14th, 201202:01 PM
Maybe it isn’t that bad all things considered….
But I wonder if the TV folks might someday throw enough money at both schools to someday make this a night game….... Of course certain safetymeasures would be needed in the area.
I am not sure how much more money the networks make for every .1 of additional ratings they earn.
December 14th, 201203:50 PM
I don't ever want a night time kickoff for the game, but I wouldn't mind an afternoon kickoff with the game getting something on par with "SEC on CBS" treatment from the marketing/production end of things.
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December 14th, 201205:03 PM
Because I live in Los Angeles and wouldn't have to travel far to see OU play at least every other year.
December 15th, 201212:05 AM
Are you serious? Losing Nebraska might have hurt but they had not been relevant for almost a decade. Missouri had a couple of good years but they have barely won 50% of their games. A&M probably hurts a little but they are identical to Arkansas with a 55% win record. Colorado was good riddance and did more to harm the Pac 12 than the Big 12. Only one good team represented the north since 2000. If there weren't divisions, two south teams probably would've played in the CCG just about every year. And no, Texas A&M wasn't one of those teams. Oklahoma didn't try and fail to get into the Pac 16. They were the one school that convinced the rest of the teams that were still here to stay. They knew that this was the best conference next to the SEC and there was no reason to kill it because Nebraska was disgruntled and the Big 10 and Pac 10 were on a shopping spree. Maybe when college football falls apart when the playoffs get here (shit, it already is because of all the greed) and everyone starts forming 20 team conferences or we drop the bottom 60 irrelevant teams then Oklahoma might make a move but I would bet that they went independent before they joined a huge conference that they had to share all their belongings with.
The Big 12 has been the 2nd best conference for over a decade and losing the a fore mentioned teams has done nothing to change that. The Big 12 was by far the best conference last year and are a close 2nd to the SEC this year. The SEC is top heavy but the Big 12 has nine teams in the top 66. The SEC is the only other conference that can say that this year but normally the SEC is just top heavy but weak the rest of the way down. The Big 12 is usually strong top to bottom with one or two bottom feeders.
Here is the average rank of the conferences from my power ratings,
RK TEAM ................. W`-`L . OPPG DPPG . OR DR RPR . .SOS . WIN% . PRED . RATING
46 SEC.................. 105-65 . 30.2 22.9 . 70 37 107 . .738 . .618 . 79.2 . `78.23
46 BIG 12................ 71-49 . 35.8 29.5 . 76 31 106 . .756 . .592 . 80.4 . `76.12
54 INDEPENDENT........... 29-19 . 26.2 20.8 . 66 39 105 . .695 . .604 . 73.3 . `70.81
54 BIG TEN............... 83-63 . 27.7 24.0 . 68 36 104 . .724 . .568 . 75.1 . `68.30
55 PAC 12................ 80-66 . 30.6 27.4 . 71 33 103 . .746 . .548 . 77.0 . `67.53
61 BIG EAST.............. 53-42 . 25.5 22.3 . 66 38 103 . .683 . .558 . 70.5 . `62.90
65 ACC................... 76-70 . 29.8 27.2 . 70 33 103 . .697 . .521 . 71.5 . `59.53
66 WAC................... 43-41 . 30.8 31.4 . 71 29 `99 . .664 . .512 . 66.0 . `54.09
72 MAC................... 79-79 . 27.8 29.5 . 68 31 `98 . .663 . .500 . 65.2 . `52.15
73 MWC................... 58-64 . 28.7 28.6 . 69 31 100 . .670 . .475 . 67.2 . `51.09
74 SUN BELT.............. 57-64 . 27.7 28.5 . 68 32 `99 . .674 . .471 . 66.8 . `50.39
82 C-USA................. 61-85 . 29.4 32.3 . 69 28 `97 . .668 . .418 . 64.8 . `43.31
It's the Big Ten and the Pac 12 that are a hair better than the Big East and ACC.
December 15th, 201201:57 AM
West Virginia has 15 conference titles and is the 14th winningest Div I program. They have a better history than Mizzou.
December 15th, 201204:08 AM
December 15th, 201206:45 AM
As grand as OU/TX is, no ****ing way I go to that part of Dallas for a night game. Can't even imagine that shithole at 11:00 pm on a Saturday. Is the Fair even open that late?
December 15th, 201208:54 AM
I guess we disagree, The Big 12 lost 4 teams, oh and then added a Big East Team ( mega conference that it is ) and MWC Team ( loaded with national title teams ) to get stronger so be it. If you are saying the Big 12 is the 2nd best conference why not stay at 8 teams when they had the chance?
December 15th, 201209:37 AM
Yep, it's open that late, and there's always a few shootings and muggings, and gang violance with the State Fair week.
And you can rest easy....I can't see under ANY circumstances, that OU or UT will have a night game in the State Fair.
December 15th, 201210:02 AM
You should tell the person who emailed you that people would take them more seriously if they didn't write like a third grader. The whole time I was reading that my mind was struggling with the quality of the information vs the fact that it looks like it was written by a 32 year old conspiracy theorist from his mom's basement.
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December 15th, 201210:22 AM
And its becoming more and more clear to me that the B12 is a dead conference walking. Everyone saying the B12 is the second best conference is living in the past.
The conspiracy theorist in me sees the GOR, the LHN and the moves other conferences are making; and says "They are trying to get us locked in just long enough that we dont affect conference realignment. Then if the B12 is stagnant and their perception is terrible (which it will be in 13 years) Texas can just go independent and all will be well.
At this point I'd be happy in the SEC, B1G or PAC; just get us out of the B12.
December 15th, 201210:28 AM
This shit wouldn't surprise me in the least...typical corporatist America...and the rich get richer and money = power.
December 15th, 201212:01 PM
What does West Virginia and TCU being from lesser conferences have to do with the strength of the Big 12?
The Big East was a good conference before the ACC raided it and got this whole expansion idea started. Miami, Virginia Tech, West Virginia, Boston College, Pitt and Syracuse are all in the top 36 in win %.. The Big East was the 2nd best conference in 2000, 2006 and 2009, 3rd in 2007 and 4th in 2008.
We would’ve been better off if we had taken TCU over Baylor in the first place. TCU has more wins than Baylor, oSu, Kansas, Iowa St and K-State.
We went to ten teams because adding two historically winning football programs helped the strength of the conference and still let us play a round robin without the need for a CCG which although brought the conference more money, did more to harm the conference when it came to BCS bowls and championships. We could’ve loaded up on bottom feeders like other conferences have done to try and create more stability but it would’ve diluted the conference.
December 15th, 201212:11 PM
Off the top of my head:
-- Tie in with the Rose Bowl
-- Away games at Outzen, The Coliseum, Rose Bowl, Seattle, Palo Alto, Boulder
-- Conference academic affiliation with Stanford, USC, Cal, UCLA, Washington
-- Basketball tourney in Las Vegas
-- Increased exposure in the entire Western United States by regularly playing games in those areas
-- Selling recruits in Texas, Oklahoma on the above points
-- World class production quality of a conference network
Last edited by DelMarSooner; December 15th, 2012 at 10:20 PM.
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