How important is #8? ...9&10? What would you do?

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  1. #51
    Originally Posted by SpankyNek View Post
    I'm not acting like that.

    I am simply stating that there are what, 2 or 3 guys that have a better resume?

    Do you really want Saban, Miles, or CUM?

    I am not saying we would have a repeat of the Blake years, but look at what has happened at Tenn. ND USC Bama before Saban A&M for a few decades.

    Great coaches are not that plentiful.
    And, more than that, it's not always good enough to have a great coach. You also have to have the right coach. And Bob Stoops was (and IMO still is) the right coach for Oklahoma.

  2. #52
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    Re: How important is #8? ...9&10? What would you do?

    Originally Posted by SpankyNek View Post
    Name one that would leave and come here that is more credentialed than the one we have.

    You can't.
    Well up until this year we could've had Meyer

  3. #53
    Originally Posted by oorah_okie View Post
    Posting:

    You're doing it wrong.
    Tell me, do we win #8 next year? What about the year after? I don't see one on the horizon. Our recruiting has already gone down hill, and the talent level of our players has at best plateaued, so what will we need to do? Because we're now in the ballpark of the 1985-2000 drought. Bob just isn't getting it done.
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  4. #54
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    Re: How important is #8? ...9&10? What would you do?

    Originally Posted by Soonerfan84 View Post
    Tell me, do we win #8 next year? What about the year after? I don't see one on the horizon. Our recruiting has already gone down hill, and the talent level of our players has at best plateaued, so what will we need to do? Because we're now in the ballpark of the 1985-2000 drought. Bob just isn't getting it done.
    He won't actually give an opinion on anything. He's just a troll.

  5. #55
    Originally Posted by Soonerfan84 View Post
    Tell me, do we win #8 next year? What about the year after? I don't see one on the horizon. Our recruiting has already gone down hill, and the talent level of our players has at best plateaued, so what will we need to do? Because we're now in the ballpark of the 1985-2000 drought. Bob just isn't getting it done.
    We're in a national title drought but its not the same as the 1985-2000 drought. In these last 12 years, we've gotten to 10 wins or more every year except two seasons. We are in a lot better shape now than we were in the 90s.

  6. #56
    Originally Posted by byrk75 View Post
    Tons of coaches would love to coach at ou
    Any coach considering Oklahoma would look at Stoops' record and accomplishments, and then would see that he would be stepping into an impossible situation. Coaches also want stability, and if Oklahoma fired Stoops, that would send the message to everyone that Oklahoma isn't a stable job, even if you've been one of the Top 5-10 coaches in the country for the last decade.
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  7. #57
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    How important is #8? ...9&10? What would you do?

    Originally Posted by Soonerfan84 View Post
    Tell me, do we win #8 next year? What about the year after? I don't see one on the horizon. Our recruiting has already gone down hill, and the talent level of our players has at best plateaued, so what will we need to do? Because we're now in the ballpark of the 1985-2000 drought. Bob just isn't getting it done.
    I can't disagree with any of that, but what you are suggesting is dumb. I could list all of Stoops accomplishments and records, but I won't because I know you're well aware of them. Stoops does need to clean house, re-assign a few coaches, have a couple seek other opportunities, etc. There is no better coach out there to get OU #8 than Stoops. Firing him is not the answer.

  8. #58
    Considering the fact that the last three national title games have ended in tragedy, I think I subconsciously associate NT games with weeks of deep, dark depression. But yeah, winning the 8th would be some shit, I just don't think we need to pay players to do it..

  9. #59
    Originally Posted by Derrouse View Post
    I can't imagine what Shipp could have done different. Manning said he was like a father to him. He went to 4 games this season alone. He knew the program. The kid wanted to go elsewhere. I hope the rumors aren't true about the girlfriend. That is just sad if it worked... Not giving Shipp a pass but this doesn't seem like anything could have swayed him.
    What about McFarland, McGee and Walker doing nothing beyond just being the starters at best the past few years ? What about Oklahoma only being left with Jordan Phillips, Jordan Wade, Marquis Anderson and Torrea Peterson (maybe) next season and no additional DT personnel as it currently stands? Schipp hasn't gotten the job done from a coaching or recruiting standpoint the past few years. I have a gut feeling that the Jordan duo will be an improvement over the current group due to their improved athleticism, but an injury to either is a huge problem.

  10. #60
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    How important is #8? ...9&10? What would you do?

    Originally Posted by zcaa0g View Post
    What about McFarland, McGee and Walker doing nothing beyond just being the starters at best the past few years ? What about Oklahoma only being left with Jordan Phillips, Jordan Wade, Marquis Anderson and Torrea Peterson (maybe) next season and no additional DT personnel as it currently stands? Schipp hasn't gotten the job done from a coaching or recruiting standpoint the past few years. I have a gut feeling that the Jordan duo will be an improvement over the current group due to their improved athleticism, but an injury to either is a huge problem.
    All valid points. I'm only talking about Manning here. He needs to step up no doubt.

  11. #61
    Originally Posted by Stein7495 View Post
    We're in a national title drought but its not the same as the 1985-2000 drought. In these last 12 years, we've gotten to 10 wins or more every year except two seasons. We are in a lot better shape now than we were in the 90s.
    We were in the game in 2003, 2004, and 2008. And we were in the hunt in 2007 and maybe 2011 if Ryan doesn't go down.

    I'm sorry but anyone comparing it to the 85-2000 drought didn't really live through it.
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  12. #62
    Originally Posted by Stein7495 View Post
    We're in a national title drought but its not the same as the 1985-2000 drought. In these last 12 years, we've gotten to 10 wins or more every year except two seasons. We are in a lot better shape now than we were in the 90s.
    We were in the game in 2003, 2004, and 2008. And we were in the hunt in 2007 and maybe 2011 if Ryan doesn't go down.

    I'm sorry but anyone comparing it to the 85-2000 drought didn't really live through it.

  13. #63
    Originally Posted by Soonerfan84 View Post
    Tell me, do we win #8 next year? What about the year after? I don't see one on the horizon. Our recruiting has already gone down hill, and the talent level of our players has at best plateaued, so what will we need to do? Because we're now in the ballpark of the 1985-2000 drought. Bob just isn't getting it done.
    did you think we where going to win #7 when we did? did ND think they were going to play for the title this year? you can't see on the horizon because your shit stained fake oakleys has you thinking your entitle ass deserves something more. gosh your starting to sound like one of those pansy that always **** on the ut board.

    we have an opportunity to finish the season 11-2 and your comparing this program to blake and smelly's? jeeeze dude you are an idiot.

  14. #64
    Originally Posted by DirtySouth_Sooner View Post
    did you think we where going to win #7 when we did? did ND think they were going to play for the title this year? you can't see on the horizon because your shit stained fake oakleys has you thinking your entitle ass deserves something more. gosh your starting to sound like one of those pansy that always **** on the ut board.

    we have an opportunity to finish the season 11-2 and your comparing this program to blake and smelly's? jeeeze dude you are an idiot.
    It's funny to see your perceived impressions of who I am. But alas, drunk post is drunk post.

  15. #65
    Originally Posted by Soonerfan84 View Post
    It's funny to see your perceived impressions of who I am. But alas, drunk post is drunk post.
    And you compared 1985-2000 to 2000-2012


    Stupid post is stupid.

  16. #66
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    Originally Posted by DHF View Post
    Any coach considering Oklahoma would look at Stoops' record and accomplishments, and then would see that he would be stepping into an impossible situation. Coaches also want stability, and if Oklahoma fired Stoops, that would send the message to everyone that Oklahoma isn't a stable job, even if you've been one of the Top 5-10 coaches in the country for the last decade.
    Another kind of coach would look at what had been accomplished, look at the fact that the previous coach had stayed there for 13 years (an eternity in college football these days), and look at what had been just missed. He would then look at the history of the program - as if he didn't already know it - and he might come to the conclusion that Oklahoma is about winning ****ing championships, and will stop at nothing to do so. They gave the previous guy all the time they could stand to give him, and he just couldn't get it done. This kind of coach would be willing to strap one on and get the job done because he was confident he could do so. Not "oh man, if Bob can't do it here I can't"

    Just a reminder for those that want to inexplicably bring up the Blake years during these types of conversations: Bob Stoops wasn't as "credentialed" as the coach he replaced either.

  17. #67
    Originally Posted by drumhead23us View Post
    Another kind of coach would look at what had been accomplished, look at the fact that the previous coach had stayed there for 13 years (an eternity in college football these days), and look at what had been just missed. He would then look at the history of the program - as if he didn't already know it - and he might come to the conclusion that Oklahoma is about winning ****ing championships, and will stop at nothing to do so. They gave the previous guy all the time they could stand to give him, and he just couldn't get it done. This kind of coach would be willing to strap one on and get the job done because he was confident he could do so. Not "oh man, if Bob can't do it here I can't"

    Just a reminder for those that want to inexplicably bring up the Blake years during these types of conversations: Bob Stoops wasn't as "credentialed" as the coach he replaced either.
    wrong ... OU didn't just let Stoops hang around for 13 years. He earned that goodwill by rebuilding a program that was at its lowest of low. NC, multiple b12 titles, bcs appearances and wins, millions of increased revenue raised, etc.

    the new coach would have to succeed immediately because the foundation has been built. DHF is correct, a top talent new coach would be an idiot to come aboard replacing a coach going 11-2 with all the other accomplishment listed.

  18. #68
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    You're missing my point. You don't think there's even one talented coach out there that thinks he can do the job immediately? You think every single talented coach in the world is scared to come into OU to try and win another NC?

  19. #69
    well if your looking to take a risk in an unproven talent (ie. Stoops back in the day), there will be plenty of candidates wanting to coach here. if you're looking for a top tier coach to change schools ... then hell no.

    for every stoops "find", there are 20 others that are a bust.

  20. #70
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    Originally Posted by DirtySouth_Sooner View Post
    well if your looking to take a risk in an unproven talent (ie. Stoops back in the day), there will be plenty of candidates wanting to coach here. if you're looking for a top tier coach to change schools ... then hell no.

    for every stoops "find", there are 20 others that are a bust.
    At what point is it worth the risk? Is there a point? How long does OU have to go between championships before it's OK to take the risk of sucking? Is it OK to NEVER win one again? He's now gone 12 seasons without one, and barring an absolute miracle and a few tragedies to other teams along the way next year we're not winning one in '13 either. So for argument's sake you have 13 straight years of one coach not winning a National Championship at Oklahoma. I ask again: how long is too long?

  21. #71
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    Originally Posted by drumhead23us View Post
    At what point is it worth the risk? Is there a point? How long does OU have to go between championships before it's OK to take the risk of sucking? Is it OK to NEVER win one again? He's now gone 12 seasons without one, and barring an absolute miracle and a few tragedies to other teams along the way next year we're not winning one in '13 either. So for argument's sake you have 13 straight years of one coach not winning a National Championship at Oklahoma. I ask again: how long is too long?
    There is no answer.

    I would say that he is still considered by the President, the AD, and the majority of fans (look for revenues to continue in their upward trend) as a guy that will get the chance to stay as long as he wants, barring scandal.

    I would love to win one next year, but I also realize that there are so many ways that a NC can get derailed that an NC, while a goal, is not an expectation.

  22. #72
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    Originally Posted by SpankyNek View Post
    There is no answer.

    I would say that he is still considered by the President, the AD, and the majority of fans (look for revenues to continue in their upward trend) as a guy that will get the chance to stay as long as he wants, barring scandal.

    I would love to win one next year, but I also realize that there are so many ways that a NC can get derailed that an NC, while a goal, is not an expectation.
    Isn't it? I seem to remember the man himself setting these expectations from the very beginning. I know there are many fans that expect another championship at some time before they die.

    Bob is in the very unenviable position of setting the bar too high for even himself. He got lucky in 2000, and he hasn't been able to replicate the feat since. The "OU Monster" is a very very hungry monster and needs to be fed. So while the standard of winning a championship is one that he's been a part of creating, it's also the one that he's being judged very harshly against right now.

  23. #73
    to say Bob lucked into a NC is just plain stupid.
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  24. #74
    Originally Posted by DHF View Post
    And you compared 1985-2000 to 2000-2012


    Stupid post is stupid.
    I was speaking of number of national championships. Stay on topic. Technically correct post is technically correct.

  25. #75
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    Originally Posted by DirtySouth_Sooner View Post
    to say Bob lucked into a NC is just plain stupid.
    One of the major factors that contributed to the title run in 2000 was the fact that we had 0 significant injuries the whole season. Pretty lucky, huh?

  26. #76
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    Originally Posted by drumhead23us View Post
    One of the major factors that contributed to the title run in 2000 was the fact that we had 0 significant injuries the whole season. Pretty lucky, huh?
    The same can be said about every national champion in one way or the other.

  27. #77
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    Nick Saban, Urban Meyer, and Pete Carroll disagree.
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  28. #78
    Originally Posted by DHF View Post
    Any coach considering Oklahoma would look at Stoops' record and accomplishments, and then would see that he would be stepping into an impossible situation. Coaches also want stability, and if Oklahoma fired Stoops, that would send the message to everyone that Oklahoma isn't a stable job, even if you've been one of the Top 5-10 coaches in the country for the last decade.
    No coach woudl question OU's program or think of it as an unstable job.

  29. #79
    Originally Posted by drumhead23us View Post
    One of the major factors that contributed to the title run in 2000 was the fact that we had 0 significant injuries the whole season. Pretty lucky, huh?
    You have to recruit well enough to have quality players to step in .. Has Saban's teams been injury free during his NC's at Bama ?

  30. #80
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    Y'all derailed this shit worse than I do.

    Answer the question...

    Would you cheat or not?

  31. #81
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    Originally Posted by ChpThril View Post
    Y'all derailed this shit worse than I do.

    Answer the question...

    Would you cheat or not?
    Oh, was that the original question?

    Hell yes. Because the vast majority of what is considered "cheating" by NCAA and societal standards is what the rest of the business world calls "Tuesday".
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  32. #82
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    Originally Posted by drumhead23us View Post
    Nick Saban, Urban Meyer, and Pete Carroll disagree.
    Please tell me about all of the devastating injuries those teams had.

  33. #83
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    You essentially said that luck was a factor in every national championship run, unless I misread your post. I provided three examples of coaches that had won more than one championship. All three also won one at the expense of Bob, too. In my mind, it stops being luck after the first one. And before we go down this road again, one of Carrol's is the AP championship. But tell me if OU was anoited AP champs that we wouldn't claim it.

    Put another way, should one injury really be all it takes to derail a NC game? In 2003 two things contributed the most to our loss (not counting having Satan on the opposing sideline). Chuck 3rd and Long's inexplicable playcalling in the 4th quarter, and Jason White having a very injured throwing hand. In 2008, people pointed to the absence of Demarco Murray as the reason we lost to UF. I'm just saying that it doesn't seem to take much for Bob's teams to be wiped out, and that better coaches/programs out there overcome adversity better than we do.

  34. #84
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    Originally Posted by drumhead23us View Post
    You essentially said that luck was a factor in every national championship run, unless I misread your post. I provided three examples of coaches that had won more than one championship. All three also won one at the expense of Bob, too. In my mind, it stops being luck after the first one. And before we go down this road again, one of Carrol's is the AP championship. But tell me if OU was anoited AP champs that we wouldn't claim it.

    Put another way, should one injury really be all it takes to derail a NC game? In 2003 two things contributed the most to our loss (not counting having Satan on the opposing sideline). Chuck 3rd and Long's inexplicable playcalling in the 4th quarter, and Jason White having a very injured throwing hand. In 2008, people pointed to the absence of Demarco Murray as the reason we lost to UF. I'm just saying that it doesn't seem to take much for Bob's teams to be wiped out, and that better coaches/programs out there overcome adversity better than we do.
    Right...

    Answer this then...if UF went without Harvin or LSU's Marcus Spears had a heavily injured foot that those games turn out the same?

    That doesn't make them lucky, and it doesn't make stoops lucky in 2000 either.

  35. #85
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    Originally Posted by SpankyNek View Post
    Right...

    Answer this then...if UF went without Harvin or LSU's Marcus Spears had a heavily injured foot that those games turn out the same?

    That doesn't make them lucky, and it doesn't make stoops lucky in 2000 either.
    Obviously we'll never know how things would have turned out.

    I think you're taking personally the fact that I said Stoops got lucky. Stoops did get lucky. It's an indisputable fact. Not having even one injury all year takes an extreme amount of LUCK in college football. Look at every single other year he coached. He had injuries all over the place. He was very lucky to not have one player hurt that year.

  36. #86
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    Originally Posted by drumhead23us View Post
    Obviously we'll never know how things would have turned out.

    I think you're taking personally the fact that I said Stoops got lucky. Stoops did get lucky. It's an indisputable fact. Not having even one injury all year takes an extreme amount of LUCK in college football. Look at every single other year he coached. He had injuries all over the place. He was very lucky to not have one player hurt that year.
    Correct, my point is that pretty much every other team that has won the national title in recent memory has also avoided the injury bug. Therefore they are lucky as well (by your definition)

    If we're gonna talk about luck:

    Tressel was lucky because of the PI....OU was dominant in their game against the bet offense in the country.

  37. #87
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    Originally Posted by SpankyNek View Post
    Correct, my point is that pretty much every other team that has won the national title in recent memory has also avoided the injury bug. Therefore they are lucky as well (by your definition)

    If we're gonna talk about luck:

    Tressel was lucky because of the PI....OU was dominant in their game against the bet offense in the country.
    Correction: The best offense in the country minus Snoop Minnis.

  38. #88
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    Originally Posted by drumhead23us View Post
    Correction: The best offense in the country minus Snoop Minnis.
    Circular argument is circular.

    So now UF and LSU were lucky to beat us?

  39. #89
    Originally Posted by drumhead23us View Post
    One of the major factors that contributed to the title run in 2000 was the fact that we had 0 significant injuries the whole season. Pretty lucky, huh?
    yeah we were soooooo lucky that our most important player on the team couldn't throw the ball 20 yards the last few games (including NC game), and we had to depend on a defense that was average through most of season to close it out for us ... and they did.

    did you even watch OU that season? geeez ..............

  40. #90
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    You're somehow still missing the point, presumably because i was right about you taking what I said about Bob personally for some reason. Bob Stoops got lucky that he had zero injuries in 2000. True or false?

    Also, Alabama lost a key player DURING the NC game against LSU last year and still won. Also, Bama lost two key offensive players this year and is playing for it all again.

    Also, the fact that he hasn't been able to replicate the feat also points to it being luck. Kind of like in a game of H.O.R.S.E., you have to hit that proof shot at the end to make sure it wasn't luck that you hit that winning shot.
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  41. #91
    Originally Posted by Onikuno View Post
    Some of you sound a lot like Tennessee fans around circa 2008...(Hell, they had it a LOT worse BEFORE the epic downfall)

    Look, I understand the frustration. I'm with a a lot of you on that. But anyone who thinks we're having "mediocre seasons" needs to stop having tunnel vision on Alabama and look at every other major program we compete with on a national level. This isn't the 1970s anymore folks. It's a lot tougher to win in 2012 then it was back then. Does that excuse everything bad that has happened or recruits we have lost? No, of course not. Losing Manning yesterday sucked. Shipp may have to go at some point. But some of you better be careful what you wish for.

    I'll always take consistent 10-11 win seasons over the nightmare that was Gibbs, Schnellenberger, and Blake. Go ahead and call me content. Ask Tennesee, USC, Miami, and Nebraska fans if they'd like to be anywhere close to where our program is right now. I promise you they'd take it in a heartbeat.
    Hell Gibbs won 9 or 10 a season didn't he ?

  42. #92
    Originally Posted by boomermagic View Post
    Hell Gibbs won 9 or 10 a season didn't he ?
    1989 - 7-4
    1990 - 8-3
    1991 - 9-3
    1992 - 5-4-2
    1993 - 9-3
    1994 - 6-6


    Average record was 7-4

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