Hispanics-Don't use the word "AMNESTY'

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  1. #1
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    Hispanics-Don't use the word "AMNESTY'

    Conservative Hispanic group tells GOP to avoid ‘amnesty’ label
    By Liz Goodwin, Yahoo! News | The Ticket – Tue, Jan 29, 2013

    A conservative pro-immigration reform group has issued talking points to Republican lawmakers, telling them to avoid referring to the U.S. citizen children of illegal immigrants as "anchor babies" or calling for the construction of an "electric fence" on the border, among other things.

    The talking points, published by BuzzFeed, went out to Republican lawmakers on the Hill as momentum builds for an immigration bill that would legalize most of the country's 11 million illegal immigrants. The memo urges lawmakers to call them "undocumented immigrants" and to avoid terms such as "aliens" or "illegals," which are seen as offensive and dehumanizing. Another phrase to avoid? "Send them all back."

    "Conservatives get a bad rap when it comes to immigration reform because of a few people who say things that can be taken to be offensive," said Jennifer Korn, executive director of the Hispanic Leadership Network, the center-right group that sent the talking points on Monday. "It all means the same thing, but the way you say it matters."
    Korn worked in the White House when President George W. Bush attempted to get immigration reform passed in his second term. Two bills—one in 2006, the other in 2007—died after a vocal grass-roots movement emerged in opposition to what it called "amnesty" for illegal immigrants. The amnesty tag stuck, even though both bills would have required any applicant to go through a lengthy legalization process that required him or her to meet certain requirements, like paying back taxes and a fine and learning English. Lawmakers received thousands of phone calls about the bill, Korn remembers, almost all of them strongly against reform.
    Korn hopes theses talking points will help avoid the "pitfalls" she saw then.

    "Right now what's really giving me heartburn is people saying 'pathway to citizenship,'" she said. "It's not a pathway to citizenship. It's 'earned legal status.' If you want conservative support you have to explain what it is so there's not this knee-jerk reaction of 'No amnesty!'"

    Sen. Marco Rubio, a Republican from Florida who's part of a bipartisan group of senators pushing for immigration reform, has used "earned residency" at times in interviews with conservative talk show hosts to describe what immigration reform would provide to qualifying illegal immigrants. Democrats, including Obama, often use "pathway to citizenship" to describe the bill.
    Earned residency?...they earned it. Pathway to citizenship is offensive? These are really grateful "immigrants".

  2. #2
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    Catapults.
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  3. #3
    **** them. They committed a crime. It's a pardon.

    What they need is a pathway back to Mexico (or wherever).
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    STFU.

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    Originally Posted by Gonzo View Post
    **** them. They committed a crime. It's a pardon.

    What they need is a pathway back to Mexico (or wherever).
    We should provide them (and the senators) maps.

  6. #6
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    Turn the signs around at the border. Problem solved.

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    And continue to **** and moan when Dems get 70% of the hispanic vote.

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    Originally Posted by beelzeBob View Post
    And continue to **** and moan when Dems get 70% of the hispanic vote.
    Which the dems always have so why would pubs make them legal...particularly with this load of 12,000,000 reprobates that will all almost certainly be poverty level?
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    There has always been a "pathway to citizenship". The problem is that the illegal aliens have chosen not to follow it. What they are looking for now is a "shortcut to entitlements".
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    Originally Posted by tcrb View Post
    There has always been a "pathway to citizenship". The problem is that the illegal aliens have chosen not to follow it. What they are looking for now is a "shortcut to entitlements".
    Under what visa category would a hotel & restaurant worker have a pathway to citizenship?

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    Re: Hispanics-Don't use the word "AMNESTY'

    Originally Posted by nocalsooner View Post
    Under what visa category would a hotel & restaurant worker have a pathway to citizenship?
    The path was to citizenship is paved withered tape and bullshit. So I'm sure it was easy for them -__- we can't all be lucky enough to be born here

  12. #12
    Originally Posted by nocalsooner View Post
    Under what visa category would a hotel & restaurant worker have a pathway to citizenship?
    Hopefully none. There is an ample supply of Americans well suited for the job. Perhaps their analysis of the relationship between the wages offered and what they get by not working works out to their advantage by not taking the position. But if ain't nobody taking the gig at the wages offered (illegals undercut the natural position of wages) and they weren't able to live better without the wages, the jobs would be filled (without immigration).

  13. #13
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    Originally Posted by Aurora View Post
    The path was to citizenship is paved withered tape and bullshit. So I'm sure it was easy for them -__- we can't all be lucky enough to be born here
    So lets give amnesty to those who do not respect us or our laws and let the people who followed the rules rot.

  14. #14

    Hispanics-Don't use the word "AMNESTY'

    Originally Posted by Aurora View Post
    The path was to citizenship is paved withered tape and bullshit. So I'm sure it was easy for them -__- we can't all be lucky enough to be born here


    Originally Posted by lokifz1 View Post
    So lets give amnesty to those who do not respect us or our laws and let the people who followed the rules rot.
    The middle ground needs to be found between these two things. Amnesty is not that. Amnesty is election manipulation.

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    Originally Posted by oucub23 View Post
    The middle ground needs to be found between these two things. Amnesty is not that. Amnesty is election manipulation.
    We give 600,000 citizenship every year. I don't know why we would need to give more than that particularly to virtually just one ethnic group.
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  16. #16
    Originally Posted by okie52 View Post
    We give 600,000 citizenship every year. I don't know why we would need to give more than that particularly to virtually just one ethnic group.
    For votes. That's the only reason.
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    We should just invade Mexico, then they won't be here illegally.

    My simple solution to a complex problem.

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    Originally Posted by smot poker View Post
    We should just invade Mexico, then they won't be here illegally.

    My simple solution to a complex problem.
    Not a bad idea...go 3-400 miles inland (level everything and eliminate juarez and other shitholes) and create a dmz with a much smaller border...Brilliant!!!... we also would need to invade Cancun and Cozumel...just to be safe.

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    Originally Posted by Gonzo View Post
    Hopefully none. There is an ample supply of Americans well suited for the job. Perhaps their analysis of the relationship between the wages offered and what they get by not working works out to their advantage by not taking the position. But if ain't nobody taking the gig at the wages offered (illegals undercut the natural position of wages) and they weren't able to live better without the wages, the jobs would be filled (without immigration).
    tcrb, you see, Gonzo is hoping that you do not know what you are talking about.


    Unfortunately, Gonzo, you sound like a central planner for the old Soviet Union. The gov't can't determine who is well-suited for jobs and assure they are filled. Soviet communism tried this approach and failed. The marketplace determines these things. Just because a tech worker got laid off, doesn't mean he is well-suited to be a hotel maid.

    To raise wages sufficiently to attract employees who are able to give the same level of producivity, many hotels and restaurants will not make a profit. Many more jobs, including the higher paying jobs will be lost, because businesses will fail. Economic activity will contract. It's hard enough for restaurants to turn a profit and your approach will put even more out of business.

  20. #20
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    for all the captains obvious out there, no, there isn't much path to citizenship for hotel and restaurant workers who've come here illegally. THATS THE WAY IT SHOULD BE.

    The path to citizenship for those who wish to immigrate to America begins OUTSIDE America wherein you petition the American Embassy for the proper visa. That path may also include obtaining gainful employment with an employer who will sponsor you for a work permit. Over time you may obtain your "green card" and, later, citizenship.

    The fact is, the "hispanic" population has gotten impatient. They had been willing to wait the generation necessary for their kids born in the USA to be citizens. Now they see the opportunity for it to all happen faster.
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    Originally Posted by cosmoxl View Post
    for all the captains obvious out there, no, there isn't much path to citizenship for hotel and restaurant workers who've come here illegally. THATS THE WAY IT SHOULD BE.

    The path to citizenship for those who wish to immigrate to America begins OUTSIDE America wherein you petition the American Embassy for the proper visa. That path may also include obtaining gainful employment with an employer who will sponsor you for a work permit. Over time you may obtain your "green card" and, later, citizenship.

    The fact is, the "hispanic" population has gotten impatient. They had been willing to wait the generation necessary for their kids born in the USA to be citizens. Now they see the opportunity for it to all happen faster.
    That was my question. What is the proper visa for someone seeking employment in the hotel/restaurant industry? What visa category? tcrb claimed there was one.

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    Originally Posted by nocalsooner View Post
    That was my question. What is the proper visa for someone seeking employment in the hotel/restaurant industry? What visa category? tcrb claimed there was one.
    I would say a person has zero chance of getting a legal visa/work permit for that line of work. To get a work permit you have to be able to do something that not many people can do.

  23. #23
    Originally Posted by nocalsooner View Post
    That was my question. What is the proper visa for someone seeking employment in the hotel/restaurant industry? What visa category? tcrb claimed there was one.
    http://usimmigration.visapro.com/J1-Visa.asp

    i think that's as close as one can get...there are a myriad of options for "hospitality" services

  24. #24
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    The gang of 8's plan was to give accelerated preference to agricultural workers on the "pathway to citizenship" er...uh..journey for American inclusion or earned residency.

  25. #25
    Originally Posted by nocalsooner View Post
    tcrb, you see, Gonzo is hoping that you do not know what you are talking about.


    Unfortunately, Gonzo, you sound like a central planner for the old Soviet Union. The gov't can't determine who is well-suited for jobs and assure they are filled. Soviet communism tried this approach and failed. The marketplace determines these things. Just because a tech worker got laid off, doesn't mean he is well-suited to be a hotel maid.

    To raise wages sufficiently to attract employees who are able to give the same level of producivity, many hotels and restaurants will not make a profit. Many more jobs, including the higher paying jobs will be lost, because businesses will fail. Economic activity will contract. It's hard enough for restaurants to turn a profit and your approach will put even more out of business.
    Seems you're arguing from both sides? You say let the market determine who fills jobs (which I'm advocating) then you argue against the market naturally adjusting itself. The ILLEGAL invaders undercut the ability of the market to find its equilibrium.

    Lets take your position out a bit. Suppose, by a miracle, Mexico and other countries no longer try to get rid of their poverty class that they don't want to take care of by advocating their illegal movement into the US. Therefore, we no longer have all these people undercutting what the wages should be. None of em. What then?

  26. #26
    Originally Posted by cosmoxl View Post
    I would say a person has zero chance of getting a legal visa/work permit for that line of work. To get a work permit you have to be able to do something that not many people can do.
    Much like the European countries our socialist brethren admire.

    Try being a "hotel worker" (from a non EU country) and getting a work permit in Germany.

  27. #27
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    Originally Posted by lokifz1 View Post
    So lets give amnesty to those who do not respect us or our laws and let the people who followed the rules rot.
    I never said that, I am the granddaughter of a German immigrant, my grandmother married an American during WWII and moved here with him in 1952. My father was born in Germany. When they arrived there was a clear easy plan for her to become a citizen because of her marriage. However at the time if she did not follow the plan she would have been deported. Even being married with a baby. Sadly for a friend of hers who wished to move here the plan was not as easy, even in 1952. I can only imagine how much worse it has become with the government interventions and red tape.
    I think people should have the option to move anywhere they choose and better themselves without the governments of the world being so crazy about it. I think that the governments of the world should have less entitlements and more opportunities to accomplish your goals and dreams.
    I believe that there has to be as cub says below a middle ground and firm plan, the path to citizenship should be clear concise and attainable.
    I think the government needs work for welfare programs, I think a lot more things should be privatized. Hope this clears up my stance.

  28. #28
    tcrb's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nocalsooner View Post
    That was my question. What is the proper visa for someone seeking employment in the hotel/restaurant industry? What visa category? tcrb claimed there was one.
    Stop putting words in my mouth. I did not claim that there was a path to citizenship for hotel/restaurant workers. There are somewhere between 600,000 - 1M new LEGAL citizens sworn in each year who found and followed the LEGAL path to citizenship....in whatever industry they are skilled in. If there is not a clear LEGAL path to US citizenship as a hotel or restaurant worker, there is a path in another industry. It is up to the immigrant worker to find that niche and get sponsored....millions do it every year from almost every country in the world.

    Just because a Mexican decides that they want to come here to live and work in the hotel/restaurant industry, or as a taxi driver, or a ditch digger doesn't mean that they should be granted that privilege. There are already rules of law that provide for emigration and eventual citizenship to this country. But 20 M Mexicans have chosen to shit on those laws and come here ILLEGALLY. Now you want to reward them for disobeying our laws.
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  29. #29
    According to norcalsooner, all Mexicans are hotel workers. I bet there are some skilled Mexicans too that want to come to America LEGALLY.

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    Aurora's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Gonzo View Post
    According to norcalsooner, all Mexicans are hotel workers. I bet there are some skilled Mexicans too that want to come to America LEGALLY.
    I know some very nice Mexicans who build houses, fences, mow lawns, weld and other skills as well.

  31. #31
    Originally Posted by Aurora View Post
    I know some very nice Mexicans who build houses, fences, mow lawns, weld and other skills as well.
    I'm sure you do. As long as they came here legally I don't have a problem with those Mexicans becoming Americans.

    My point is: we don't need the illegals.

  32. #32
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    The French don't share the "kinder, gentler" view of Dems and some pubs on illegals:

    We Kicked Out More Illegal Immigrants than Ever Before in 2011: France Reveals It Deported 33,000 People in Just 12 Months

    Rebecca Seales, Daily Mail (London), January 10, 2012

    France expelled more illegal immigrants last year than ever before, its government announced today.

    Interior minister Claude Gueant told a press conference that the French authorities removed 32,912 illegal immigrants in 2011, up 17.5 per cent from 2010.

    ‘This result is 5,000 higher than the initial objective decided upon at the start of the year. It is the highest result ever achieved,’ he said.

    Mr Gueant, a close ally of President Sarkozy and a well-known hardliner on immigration, said he wants the number of expulsions to rise to 35,000 this year.

    He also vowed to significantly reduce legal immigration.

    Mr Gueant added that immigrants who want to stay in France will have to shed traditions which contradict French values, saying: ‘We reject . . . cloistered lives lived along ethnic and religious grounds, those that live by their own laws.

    ‘The foreigners that we welcome here must integrate themselves. It is up to them to adapt to us, not the other way around.’

    The comment was in part a reference to France’s ban on Islamic face veils, a 2010 law that supporters said defended women’s freedoms and critics said stigmatized millions of moderate Muslims.

    France is home to the largest Muslim population in western Europe, and many have family ties to former French colonies in North Africa.

    The majority of immigrants to France arrive legally, but the number of new arrivals is shrinking and Mr Gueant wants to reduce it further.

    The number of residency permits issued last year shrank 3.6 percent to 182,595, the interior minister said.

    ‘We want to fight against illegal immigration and control the flow of normal immigration to France.

    ‘What is at stake is the cohesion and the equilibrium of our society and our ability to maintain our tradition of welcoming them,’ he told reporters.

    With the French presidential elections scheduled for April and May, the high-profile announcement is being seen as an attempt by President Sarkozy to appeal to anti-immigrant voters.

    Mr Sarkozy has championed strict policies on crime and illegal immigration, but is threatened in this area by far-right presidential candidate Marine Le Pen, who has a strong voter base and whose National Front party is strongly anti-immigration.

    While the President has not formally announced his candidacy for the spring elections, he is widely expected to seek a second term in power.
    http://www.amren.com/news/2012/01/fr...ust-12-months/


    Viva la France!!!!

  33. #33
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    Originally Posted by Gonzo View Post
    I'm sure you do. As long as they came here legally I don't have a problem with those Mexicans becoming Americans.

    My point is: we don't need the illegals.
    I for one think that people who employ the illegals are as much a part of the problem as anyone, I guess me included. I will assume my lawn guy is not legally here. I could be a big girl, by a new mower and make my fella mow for me but the money I give to the lawn guy frees up extra time for us.

    However some companies paying the illegals would have to raise prices because they had to pay a living wage or gasp lower the pay of the CEOs ... There is a happy medium but neither side is good at happy mediums and we the people get ****ed from their play ground shenanigans all the time.
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  34. #34
    Damn French Franks stole the land from the Gauls and ****d their culture. Now they don't want illegal immigrants??? Racists!!

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    Originally Posted by Gonzo View Post
    Damn French Franks stole the land from the Gauls and ****d their culture. Now they don't want illegal immigrants??? Racists!!
    LOL...I just want to know which countries aren't countries of immigrants...since US politicians seem to believe we are the only ones that have done it.

  36. #36
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    Originally Posted by okie52 View Post
    Which the dems always have so why would pubs make them legal...particularly with this load of 12,000,000 reprobates that will all almost certainly be poverty level?
    There are alot of Hispanics either here legally or are citizens that would probably vote Republican if you wern't so gung ho about deporting their friends and loved ones.

  37. #37
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    Originally Posted by tcrb View Post
    Stop putting words in my mouth. I did not claim that there was a path to citizenship for hotel/restaurant workers. There are somewhere between 600,000 - 1M new LEGAL citizens sworn in each year who found and followed the LEGAL path to citizenship....in whatever industry they are skilled in. If there is not a clear LEGAL path to US citizenship as a hotel or restaurant worker, there is a path in another industry. It is up to the immigrant worker to find that niche and get sponsored....millions do it every year from almost every country in the world.

    Just because a Mexican decides that they want to come here to live and work in the hotel/restaurant industry, or as a taxi driver, or a ditch digger doesn't mean that they should be granted that privilege. There are already rules of law that provide for emigration and eventual citizenship to this country. But 20 M Mexicans have chosen to shit on those laws and come here ILLEGALLY. Now you want to reward them for disobeying our laws.
    An immigrant can't get citizenship without first getting a green card (i.e., becoming a resident alien).

    You said:
    There has always been a "pathway to citizenship". The problem is that the illegal aliens have chosen not to follow it
    .

    Many are not eligible to get a green card, so it wasn't simply because they chose not to follow the pathway.

  38. #38
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    Originally Posted by Tundra View Post
    Turn the signs around at the border. Problem solved.

    How is that going to solve anything? Most of them are illiterate.

  39. #39
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    Originally Posted by beelzeBob View Post
    There are alot of Hispanics either here legally or are citizens that would probably vote Republican if you wern't so gung ho about deporting their friends and loved ones.
    The hispanics were so grateful after Reagan gave them amnesty that they voted over 2-1 for Dukakis in the next election. In fact, the hispanics have averaged over 2-1 for dems for over 30 years. McCain was killed by them in 2008 and he sponsored comprehensive immigration reform. The sad truth is that over 2/3 of the hispanics here legally are near or below the poverty line and have supported big government and dems for quite a while. Giving citizenship to 12,000,000 more illegals almost certainly will be exacerbate the situation.
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  40. #40
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    57% of illegal ailiens with children are on government assistance 70% in Texas. Adding 11 million people to obamacare is what we need right now.

  41. #41
    Originally Posted by lokifz1 View Post
    57% of illegal ailiens with children are on government assistance 70% in Texas. Adding 11 million people to obamacare is what we need right now.
    Sources? Not trolling serious inquiry

  42. #42
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    Originally Posted by lokifz1 View Post
    57% of illegal ailiens with children are on government assistance 70% in Texas. Adding 11 million people to obamacare is what we need right now.
    Ultimately it will be a much higher figure than 11,000,000 once family reunification kicks in.

  43. #43
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    Originally Posted by lokifz1 View Post
    57% of illegal ailiens with children are on government assistance 70% in Texas. Adding 11 million people to obamacare is what we need right now.
    Do away with the subsidized school lunch program to fix that.

  44. #44
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    Originally Posted by okie52 View Post
    The hispanics were so grateful after Reagan gave them amnesty that they voted over 2-1 for Dukakis in the next election. In fact, the hispanics have averaged over 2-1 for dems for over 30 years. McCain was killed by them in 2008 and he sponsored comprehensive immigration reform. The sad truth is that over 2/3 of the hispanics here legally are near or below the poverty line and have supported big government and dems for quite a while. Giving citizenship to 12,000,000 more illegals almost certainly will be exacerbate the situation.
    Reagan had already ****ed every single one of them while gov. Of CA. Was his act of guilt worth their vote?

  45. #45
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    Originally Posted by SpankyNek View Post
    Reagan had already ****ed every single one of them while gov. Of CA. Was his act of guilt worth their vote?
    Please elaborate on how Ronnie ****ed illegals over in the 70's. Evidently his act of guilt, W's act of "compassion" and McCain's act of stupidity were never enough.

  46. #46
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    Originally Posted by okie52 View Post
    Please elaborate on how Ronnie ****ed illegals over in the 70's. Evidently his act of guilt, W's act of "compassion" and McCain's act of stupidity were never enough.
    He used governmental force and pressure against Cesar Chavez and the United Farm Workers.

    The GOP is still paying for the grapes Ronnie ate on TV in 69.

  47. #47
    Originally Posted by oucub23 View Post
    The middle ground needs to be found between these two things. Amnesty is not that. Amnesty is election manipulation.
    Don't allow them to vote for lets say 25+ years...

  48. #48
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    Originally Posted by SpankyNek View Post
    He used governmental force and pressure against Cesar Chavez and the United Farm Workers.

    The GOP is still paying for the grapes Ronnie ate on TV in 69.
    All of the Hispanics were farm workers? All of the farm workers were hispanics? What a diverse group. Did he screw them over like he did the ATC? Were all Hispanics living in California? Were most of the current legal Hispanics even born when he "brought force and pressure". This ****ed over everyone of them is an amazing accomplishment given the fact that all Hispanics didn't live in California or work in the vineyards. I really doubt Ron lost a lot of sleep over it

    The reality is that most legal Hispanics live near the poverty level and they have voted for big government and dems for over 30 years. They will continue to do so even when rinos like W and McCain try to be doormats for them.

  49. #49
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    Originally Posted by nocalsooner View Post
    An immigrant can't get citizenship without first getting a green card (i.e., becoming a resident alien).

    You said: .

    Many are not eligible to get a green card, so it wasn't simply because they chose not to follow the pathway.
    umm...what??!! They chose not to follow the rules. The rules were set in place long before "they" decided to break them. If you choose to take a dirt road instead of the highway don't complain later that the guvment didn't build YOU a highway where YOU wanted.

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    Originally Posted by cosmoxl View Post
    umm...what??!! They chose not to follow the rules. The rules were set in place long before "they" decided to break them. If you choose to take a dirt road instead of the highway don't complain later that the guvment didn't build YOU a highway where YOU wanted.
    But you're blaming them for taking he dirt road when the highway didn't exist.

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