Most difficult position to project out of HS

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  1. #1

    Strategy Most difficult position to project out of HS

    Has to be OL right? You never know how those players are going to develop. The easiest to project to me has to be RB, its the simplest position on the field

  2. #2

    Re: Most difficult position to project out of HS

    Originally Posted by usaosooner View Post
    Has to be OL right? You never know how those players are going to develop. The easiest to project to me has to be RB, its the simplest position on the field
    I'd say OL and CB's hardest.

  3. #3
    QB or DB. You never know how well a star quarterback in high school is going to adjust to playing at the next level. Same for the DB's. In high school, up until the playoffs they're covering slow ass receivers who run bad routs. Although, OL is sometimes hard to project.

  4. #4
    Originally Posted by usaosooner View Post
    Has to be OL right? You never know how those players are going to develop. The easiest to project to me has to be RB, its the simplest position on the field
    I would think QB is the most difficult to project because of the change of the speed of the game. You can't quite simulate it at the HS level. Same thing with the transition to the NFL. But that seems like an obvious answer to me. I would think OL is tougher for laymen to 'scout' because most people that haven't played or coached OL (I played OL btw) don't really know what they are looking at. I'm not saying I am familiar with modern schemes (it has been almost 20 years since I played OL) but I've never seen that many people opine about it with any sophistication, even in national media. Trevor Matich perhaps, and very few others. Not even Mark May. It is among the most complex positions to play. Probably second only to QB.

    I disagree about RB being the most simple position. After they get the ball, all they are doing is reading the defense. And that doesn't factor in pass blocking/catching. You'll find more RB busts than a lot of other positions.

    DL is the simplest position (to play) on the field (WR is runner-up).
    DL, specifically DT is almost purely physical and reactionary once you cover your gap.It's also fairly easy to project HS DL, specifically DT's, all depending on how they later condition themselves.

    There are multiple reasons for busts though, which can make projections look awful. It's rare to miss a DL guy on pure talent. Personally, I think most of that is due to projecting that a guy will develop and he doesn't. And considering the premium on DT's, there are probably a lot of those kind of projections (a literal 'project' to be developed) at that position. In other words, just because there are busts at DL or DT doesn't mean it's difficult to project. It's difficult to develop, hence - those that are developed or are developing well are relatively easy to spot.
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  5. #5

    Most difficult position to project out of HS

    RB.

    They all seem to turn out to be average at best, injury prone, or quitting prone after they get here.

    I mean, seriously, we used our backup quarterback as a short yardage running back for almost two years.

    /thread

  6. #6

    Re: Most difficult position to project out of HS

    Originally Posted by Hamilton View Post
    I would think QB is the most difficult to project because of the change of the speed of the game. You can't quite simulate it at the HS level. Same thing with the transition to the NFL. But that seems like an obvious answer to me. I would think OL is tougher for laymen to 'scout' because most people that haven't played or coached OL (I played OL btw) don't really know what they are looking at. I'm not saying I am familiar with modern schemes (it has been almost 20 years since I played OL) but I've never seen that many people opine about it with any sophistication, even in national media. Trevor Matich perhaps, and very few others. Not even Mark May. It is among the most complex positions to play. Probably second only to QB.

    I disagree about RB being the most simple position. After they get the ball, all they are doing is reading the defense. And that doesn't factor in pass blocking/catching. You'll find more RB busts than a lot of other positions.

    DL is the simplest position (to play) on the field (WR is runner-up).
    DL, specifically DT is almost purely physical and reactionary once you cover your gap.It's also fairly easy to project HS DL, specifically DT's, all depending on how they later condition themselves.

    There are multiple reasons for busts though, which can make projections look awful. It's rare to miss a DL guy on pure talent. Personally, I think most of that is due to projecting that a guy will develop and he doesn't. And considering the premium on DT's, there are probably a lot of those kind of projections (a literal 'project' to be developed) at that position. In other words, just because there are busts at DL or DT doesn't mean it's difficult to project. It's difficult to develop, hence - those that are developed or are developing well are relatively easy to spot.
    I agree with the DL. Which is why Shipp needs to go.

  7. #7
    QB. There have been more 5 star busts at QB position than any other position. But in the end, they are all very difficult to project, because the level of competition they face varies, sometimes they aren't very smart and just dominated with raw athletic skill that doesn't quite have the same impact at the collegiate level and many times, you have players who already peaked at the prep level and see zero improvement at the collegiate level.
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  8. #8
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    Originally Posted by zcaa0g View Post
    QB. There have been more 5 star busts at QB position than any other position. But in the end, they are all very difficult to project, because the level of competition they face varies, sometimes they aren't very smart and just dominated with raw athletic skill that doesn't quite have the same impact at the collegiate level and many times, you have players who already peaked at the prep level and see zero improvement at the collegiate level.
    Well put. I would think getting guys in your camp is the only way you can really get a good look at their raw physical skills.

  9. #9
    i think if we are saying what position is the most likely to be a low rated player and get to the NFL then it's O line...very few 2* and 3* qb's make the NFL and stay there whereas there are tons of Olinemen in the league who were 2/3* so i agree. If we mean a transition from H.S. to College then i'd say qb and oline just because of the speed

  10. #10
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    On the D it's MLB. On O it's QB. Both have to read correctly or there's a disaster. On D, CB would be a very close second, and on O the Center.

  11. #11
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  12. #12
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    Originally Posted by zcaa0g View Post
    QB. There have been more 5 star busts at QB position than any other position. But in the end, they are all very difficult to project, because the level of competition they face varies, sometimes they aren't very smart and just dominated with raw athletic skill that doesn't quite have the same impact at the collegiate level and many times, you have players who already peaked at the prep level and see zero improvement at the collegiate level.
    Disagree about QB. Watch his film and study his mentality. Look at the competition he's playing against. Are they overmatched and does he look bored? Take LJ, for example. Excelled against lower competition (in NM too), but I'm not sure his teams overmatched opponents everytime. He wasn't surrounded by superior talent, but was able to make the best of what he had for the most part. So you could kind of see how he played in that situation. I cannot recall seeing much film of Landry playing under pressure (i.e. avoiding blitzes, etc.), so that aspect of his game was unknown. In contrast, Garret Gilbert 5* #1, played at powerhouse Lake Travis (4A in Texas). Opponents were highly overmatched and he had a 6'4 or 6'5 TE to just throw it up too and play catch. His highlight films showcased him out-running or running over inferior competition and throwing to a guy who had a 6-8" advantage over every guy he faced. He was never challenged. Given that, you should suspect that he's going to struggle some against a level playing field. You couldn't project he was going to be as bad as he was though.

    Most 5*s are given that based on the magic word "potential". None of those guys get "projected" to be a 1st-team all-conference, blah, blah, blah. GG had the "potential" to dominate like he did in high school. They're given 5* based on measurables, highlights (not film study), maybe a 7-on-7 camp, and the "potential of their raw athletic ability". I believe it is more difficult to project a 5* QB based on this premise b/c these "recruiting experts" are saying the guy could be a Heisman winner or a backup WR who happens to be able to also throw the ball. They give themselves an out. In general, I do not believe it is the most difficult position to project. There is too much natural ability and mental aptitude that can be seen from QB film to consistently miss on them.

    IMO, offensive line is the toughest. Not too many are truly tested at the high school level on a consistent basis where you can evaluate a ton of film at a highly competitive level. You cannot see on film how OL guys are adjusting calls based on the defensive lineup. In high school, they pretty much just lineup and go. In some cases, you can see some aptitude post-snap and some natural athletic ability, but again, in general, you typically do not. Some of our best guys (in the Stoops era) were 3* or converted d-linemen. The most highly-rated one (Stephen Good 5*) was merely servicable. It's just really difficult.

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  14. #14
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    The situation-based dime back has to be the most difficult. How can a coach look at a player and think "when it's 3-15 on our 38 and the offense has 4 WRs, no RB, and an extra TE, this guy is going to be murderous"? I dare you to tell me how...
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  15. #15
    I'd have to go with Head Coach. There's a laundry list of great high school coaches that don't seem to pan out once they make the jump to college.
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  16. #16
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    OL are the hardest to project.

    They usually undergo the largest physical changes and have more to learn than some of the other postions…

  17. #17
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    I have to go with CB. A lot of highschools will play their best cover guy at FS so they can have more of an impact over the entire field. Additionally in college the route trees are far more complex, facing better athletes, better QBs, and more coverages to keep track of.

  18. #18
    QB, and all you have to do is look at OU's history of highly rated QBs. And then there's ut...

  19. #19
    melbitoast's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by SoonerSapper View Post
    I have to go with CB. A lot of highschools will play their best cover guy at FS so they can have more of an impact over the entire field. Additionally in college the route trees are far more complex, facing better athletes, better QBs, and more coverages to keep track of.
    Why would a CB be worried about a route tree?? He's not defending a route tree; just a guy running a route. I've never heard of a CB going "oh shit! not a post pattern!" But you will hear him say "oh shit, I'm on Broyles."

  20. #20
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    Originally Posted by melbitoast View Post
    Why would a CB be worried about a route tree?? He's not defending a route tree; just a guy running a route. I've never heard of a CB going "oh shit! not a post pattern!" But you will hear him say "oh shit, I'm on Broyles."
    Down and distance tendacies, and formation tendacies play a factor in it. Watch the pass routes college recievers run against what HS recievers run, theres a major difference.

  21. #21
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    Agree there's a difference. No doubt. But I don't think it's the hardest to project. 3 and long is 3rd and long. 16 yards in HS is the same distance in college. Plus, down and distance and tendancies affect every position on the field; not just CBs. Again, enough film could tell you if the kid has good instincts and play recognition skills. The level of HS competition faced always helps determine level of ability as well.

  22. #22
    ab5sr's Avatar
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    TE for OU. They always seem to move them somewhere else.

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