I am Torn About These Murder Charges

Posted 651 day(s) ago by Aurora4481 Views 265 Replies
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  1. #101
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    Originally Posted by McRib View Post
    I was in mental health hearings all afternoon, but really wanna read this thread. Before I do - has it already been ****ed over? If so, I'll dis move on.
    nope, somehow its still on topic.

  2. #102
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    Originally Posted by McRib View Post
    I was in mental health hearings all afternoon, but really wanna read this thread. Before I do - has it already been ****ed over? If so, I'll dis move on.
    It has actually been pretty civil.

  3. #103
    Originally Posted by beelzeBob View Post
    It has actually been pretty civil.
    True. Except for those thinking the father is anything but innocent, this has been an educated conversation.
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  4. #104

    Re: I am Torn About These Murder Charges

    Originally Posted by KCRuf/Nek View Post
    But it doesn't justify going and getting a gun and murdering someone in cold blood. I can't believe you or anyone else is defending this guy.
    Seriously. This isn't rocket science people, you aren't allowed to go and murder people because you are angry about losing a child.
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  5. #105
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    I am Torn About These Murder Charges

    Originally Posted by OnlyOneOklahoma View Post
    Seriously. This isn't rocket science people, you aren't allowed to go and murder people because you are angry about losing a child.
    No, but mental anguish can be a mitigating circumstance. However. As Bruno said earlier, it would be difficult prove given his apparent calculation.

  6. #106
    Originally Posted by McRib View Post
    No, but mental anguish can be a mitigating circumstance. However. As Bruno said earlier, it would be difficult prove given his apparent calculation.
    But haven't there been cases where it was determined that a person was still in the "heat of the moment" (or whatever the lingo is) hours after the incident; or am I thinking of 100 episodes of Law and Order?

  7. #107
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    Originally Posted by brokebacksooner View Post
    But haven't there been cases where it was determined that a person was still in the "heat of the moment" (or whatever the lingo is) hours after the incident; or am I thinking of 100 episodes of Law and Order?
    Time is certainly not the only factor and that is the point I was hoping to make. That is why it is not an open/shut case and needs to be tried and decided upon by a jury. I think they got the the Ersland case right, and I think they could still get this one right if they did not convict of 1st degree murder. On the other hand, if I were to sit on the jury, after hearing all of the facts, I might vote to convict on 1st degree murder.
    I'm amused by all of the people who believe they know how this case should turn out. I'm informed by the fact that people on here who actually spend time in courtrooms, in the due course of their profession, however, say that it could go either way.

  8. #108
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    I am Torn About These Murder Charges

    Originally Posted by brokebacksooner View Post
    But haven't there been cases where it was determined that a person was still in the "heat of the moment" (or whatever the lingo is) hours after the incident; or am I thinking of 100 episodes of Law and Order?
    Sure - but if the behavior therein appears to be accompanied by coherent thought and a plan, it may be difficult for a jury to find he acted out of heat of passion beyond reasonable doubt. The judge will I guess offer them lesser options.

  9. #109

    I am Torn About These Murder Charges

    Originally Posted by OnlyOneOklahoma View Post
    Unfortunately for that guy, he is not the Justice maker in society. I hope he enjoys sitting in jail for 20+ years.
    Actually, he was in fact the justice maker in this situation.

  10. #110
    If someone in the drunk guys family would Jack Ruby the Dad outside the hearing, then justice would be done.

    then someone else from the Dad's family could whack someone from drunk guy's family because of the courthouse steps killing.

    Then Drunk Guy's family could exact revenge on Dad's family because of the revenge killing at the courthouse.

    Then Dad's family...aww **** it.

  11. #111
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    Originally Posted by McRib View Post
    Sure - but if the behavior therein appears to be accompanied by coherent thought and a plan, it may be difficult for a jury to find he acted out of heat of passion beyond reasonable doubt. The judge will I guess offer them lesser options.
    See, I think running to your house to get a gun to kill a guy, isn't coherent, and doesn't really require much planning. Getting a gun from your nearby home isn't vastly different from grabbing it from your glove box. I'm guessing he made it to his home and back before the police arrived to investigate the accident.

    I'm not deciding either way, as I don't have all of the facts.

  12. #112
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    I am Torn About These Murder Charges

    Originally Posted by Shooterms View Post
    See, I think running to your house to get a gun to kill a guy, isn't coherent, and doesn't really require much planning. Getting a gun from your nearby home isn't vastly different from grabbing it from your glove box. I'm guessing he made it to his home and back before the police arrived to investigate the accident.

    I'm not deciding either way, as I don't have all of the facts.
    Yeah, several unknowns, no way to tell without an exact timeline, proximities, etc. Will depend on how they play it. Could go either way.

  13. #113
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    if this goes to trial, he wont see a day behind bars.
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  14. #114
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    Originally Posted by McRib View Post
    Yeah, several unknowns, no way to tell without an exact timeline, proximities, etc. Will depend on how they play it. Could go either way.
    They should put all of the facts in front of some sort of organized tribunal that is governed by rules of fair play, and then let an unbiased group of people decide what should happen.

  15. #115
    I'd vote to acquit. Criminal punishment is about protection and/or rehabilitation. I don't think we need protection from Mr. Barajas (unless he has more kids) and rehabilitation seems unnecessary as well. Send him home to grieve.

  16. #116
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    I am Torn About These Murder Charges

    Originally Posted by Shooterms View Post
    They should put all of the facts in front of some sort of organized tribunal that is governed by rules of fair play, and then let an unbiased group of people decide what should happen.
    That's a gawddamn excellent idea.
    You win the day, young man
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  17. #117
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    I am Torn About These Murder Charges

    Originally Posted by ImTheDude View Post
    Can't say I wouldn't do the same thing if some drunk killed my two sons in front of me.
    Agreed. Who are we to judge this father. An eye for an eye.

  18. #118
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    Originally Posted by nlight1 View Post
    Agreed. Who are we to judge this father. An eye for an eye.

    Well, some version of "we" is likely going to judge him, but hopefully that will occur after a complete recitation of the facts, rather than the limited information that is required on a message board to determine if someone should rot in the pen.

  19. #119
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    I don't think an insanity plea or defense can go to a jury. It would have to be correlated with a plea bargain.

  20. #120
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    Originally Posted by SpankyNek View Post
    I don't think an insanity plea or defense can go to a jury. It would have to be correlated with a plea bargain.
    No. They go before a jury.

  21. #121
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    I am Torn About These Murder Charges

    Originally Posted by KCRuf/Nek View Post
    No. They go before a jury.
    An insanity plea would have to pass a certain burden of proof before the judge would allow it to go to the jury. His state of mind after seeing his children dead may be enough, but we won't know until he is evaluated by a court appointed shrink.

  22. #122
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    You guize make
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    Laff

  23. #123
    Originally Posted by Stinger_1066 View Post
    It needs to go to trial and let a jury of his peers decide his punishment. If I were on the jury I would vote to acquit.

    sounds like justifiable homicide to me....

  24. #124
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    Originally Posted by 87sooner View Post
    sounds like justifiable homicide to me....
    So one day when your son goes out hotrodding in his 'Vette and slams into a family, killing them, and the father goes home, gets his gun, comes back, and kills your son you're okay with that?
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  25. #125
    Originally Posted by KCRuf/Nek View Post
    So one day when your son goes out hotrodding in his 'Vette and slams into a family, killing them, and the father goes home, gets his gun, comes back, and kills your son you're okay with that?
    Weird sense of justice. I doubt there is any way the murdered knew the other murderer was drunk, and even then it does not make it right. Killing the guy only means that (if the guy is married) the spouse has to live without children and a husband now.

    It was a senseless and foolish, unjustifiable killing. (I can sympathize, but that is about it)

  26. #126
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    Originally Posted by OnlyOneOklahoma View Post
    Weird sense of justice. I doubt there is any way the murdered knew the other murderer was drunk, and even then it does not make it right. Killing the guy only means that (if the guy is married) the spouse has to live without children and a husband now.

    It was a senseless and foolish, unjustifiable killing. (I can sympathize, but that is about it)
    I worked with some guys at the casino that had that sort of mentality. They were of all political thoughts and backgrounds. They all said that if something happened to one of their kids they'd kill the guy. I just don't get it. When my daughter got slapped around by an old bf I could have run over there with my pistol and whipped him with it, stuck it in his mouth, or killed him. I let the police handle it and he went to jail. They thought I was a **** for not ****ing him up. I can understand the urge to met your own form of justice but that's not how I was raised.
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  27. #127
    Drunk guy killed two Mexican kids being raised by a father that felt murder was ok.

    Drunk guy should have died for killing two kids.

    I see this as a win-win
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  28. #128
    Originally Posted by Mrs. Tuscany Stoops View Post
    This guy, what a murdering piece of scum and a shitty parent. He should have just made his wife murder those babies from the get go and he could have afforded a better ****ing truck to begin with.
    You sound like you browse 4chan.

  29. #129
    Forget the gun...go home or take out your trusty Old Timer pocket knife, cut his sack and run his leg throught it,then let the law have whats left of him.

  30. #130
    Originally Posted by KCRuf/Nek View Post
    So one day when your son goes out hotrodding in his 'Vette and slams into a family, killing them, and the father goes home, gets his gun, comes back, and kills your son you're okay with that?

    no...i'd be disappointed i wasn't the one who got to shoot him first.....

  31. #131
    Originally Posted by soonerintn View Post
    Ever been in a car crash? You get a huge adrenalin surge and don't really think clearly. I don't care that he left and came back. He wasn't in his right mind and he had the adrenalin on board.

    I could see temporary insanity.
    I have.

    I don't have to tell you adrenalin does not equal insanity. If adrenalin was enough, or anger, or emotion, the number of M1 convictions in this country would be a fraction of what it is today.

    As I said before, it's hard for me to Forster a scenario where this gentlemen doesn't do significant jail time.
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  32. #132
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    Originally Posted by 87sooner View Post
    no...i'd be disappointed i wasn't the one who got to shoot him first.....

  33. #133
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    Originally Posted by 87sooner View Post
    no...i'd be disappointed i wasn't the one who got to shoot him first.....
    You're an idiot
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  34. #134
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    Originally Posted by OnlyOneOklahoma View Post
    Still doesn't give you the right to kill someone for wrecking into you.
    I bet you had a big brother in school with you. One that let you run your mouth because you knew he'd protect you.

  35. #135
    late to the party. nothing really new to add. no way this guy doesn't do some jail time. there is no way a precedence can be set where murder is ok. where's the line? 2 kids dead, it's fine. 2 kids chronically injured? fine or not fine?

  36. #136
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    Originally Posted by OnlyOneOklahoma View Post
    Seriously. This isn't rocket science people, you aren't allowed to go and murder people because you are angry about losing a child.
    Yet, you think it's fine for someone to go and murder people because they didn't want to use a condom... see... hypocrite...

  37. #137
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    Originally Posted by OnlyOneOklahoma View Post
    Seriously. This isn't rocket science people, you aren't allowed to go and murder people because you are angry about losing a child.
    well you are not allowed to murder kids with drones either but it happens

  38. #138
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    Originally Posted by SoonerinBoulder View Post
    late to the party. nothing really new to add. no way this guy doesn't do some jail time. there is no way a precedence can be set where murder is ok. where's the line? 2 kids dead, it's fine. 2 kids chronically injured? fine or not fine?
    Like I said I can see his side, his rage and moment of revenge. I never said murder is cool. But I will tell you being a mom I might have the same reaction if some **** plowed into my kid and killed him. I honestly think this man is probably fine with prison since living without your kids has to be the worst thing I can imagine.

  39. #139
    Originally Posted by Aurora View Post
    well you are not allowed to murder kids with drones either but it happens
    This.Is.Laughable.

  40. #140
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    Originally Posted by 2121sooner View Post
    This.Is.Laughable.
    is it ...

  41. #141
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    Originally Posted by Aurora View Post
    well you are not allowed to murder kids with drones either but it happens
    What do you expect? Our government is a borderline terrorist organization.

  42. #142
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    Originally Posted by DIB View Post
    What do you expect? Our government is a borderline terrorist organization.
    Truth and the parents of these kids do not find it laughable

  43. #143
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    I would not begin to suggest that I think his actions where right. Were I on the jury I would not vote to convict him of anything worse than possibly jay-walking on his way to his house to get the gun.

    The possibility exists that the DA is charging him with 1st degree murder BECAUSE he knows he'll never get a conviction. The DA is seen doing his job and charging someone who committed a crime, and he doesn't have to worry that it will lead to putting a man in jail who doesn't need to be there.

  44. #144
    Most of those were girls that were going to live a horribly oppressed life and end up having their ****s cut up at 12 because their 45 year old husband thought Allah told him to do it

  45. #145
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    Well no the less I will follow a long and let y'all know what happens. This thread has been interesting. I think my favorite part is where KC can't stand to agree with anything I post so much he agreed with OOO =)
    Also KC is like my 6 or 7th favorite poster maybe my 2-3rd old dude poster

  46. #146
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    Originally Posted by 2121sooner View Post
    Most of those were girls that were going to live a horribly oppressed life and end up having their ****s cut up at 12 because their 45 year old husband thought Allah told him to do it
    well **** when you put it that way maybe drone strike death is not so ****ing bad... Sandra Fluke's stupid ass should start fighting for them =)

  47. #147
    I'm glad you have an open mind

    And.......you're welcome
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  48. #148
    I wrote a short story similar to this situation that was published in the anthology "2012: Final Prayer."

    Shameless plug: available at Amazon!
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  49. #149
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    Originally Posted by Aurora View Post
    Well no the less I will follow a long and let y'all know what happens. This thread has been interesting. I think my favorite part is where KC can't stand to agree with anything I post so much he agreed with OOO =)
    Also KC is like my 6 or 7th favorite poster maybe my 2-3rd old dude poster
    Yep. I've been driven into the arms of many different people but this is a first.

  50. #150
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    Originally Posted by Aurora View Post
    well **** when you put it that way maybe drone strike death is not so ****ing bad... Sandra Fluke's stupid ass should start fighting for them =)
    Whatever happened to her? I thought she was as important to our everyday existence as sun, air, and water.

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